The 2012 and beyond Political Thread - Part 2
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SurSteven:
al Sabah:
love2travel:
I always wondered...for all of the money spent on war and military. Couldn't the just give everyone a house, car, food and a four day work week. Would people except that alternative over fighting? Something like an incentive program. I know it sounds a bit mad, but wouldn't it be nice to not have fighting in your neighborhood, and not to have to worry about your children? Would you choose to have the house car and food neighborhood, or would you choose to live in the fighting each other neighborhood? A bit simplistic, I know...but with the money spent....surely there could be better incentives.
Winning hearts and minds might work when disputes are over economics and privilege, but how do you win over a group that wants your extinction?
everyone is thinking the same thing
I believe that's exactly what they want "everyone" to believe. It's been said historically that Hitler's Nazi (mobster/bully) group was really small in the beginnings - but they pretended to be bigger & more powerful than what they really were. In reality, they were very stoppable & vulnerable in the beginnings. But too many people were too afraid to take them on - exactly what they wanted people to believe.
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Andy_Shofar:
SurSteven:
al Sabah:
love2travel:
I always wondered...for all of the money spent on war and military. Couldn't the just give everyone a house, car, food and a four day work week. Would people except that alternative over fighting? Something like an incentive program. I know it sounds a bit mad, but wouldn't it be nice to not have fighting in your neighborhood, and not to have to worry about your children? Would you choose to have the house car and food neighborhood, or would you choose to live in the fighting each other neighborhood? A bit simplistic, I know...but with the money spent....surely there could be better incentives.
Winning hearts and minds might work when disputes are over economics and privilege, but how do you win over a group that wants your extinction?
everyone is thinking the same thing
I believe that's exactly what they want "everyone" to believe. It's been said historically that Hitler's Nazi (mobster/bully) group was really small in the beginnings - but they pretended to be bigger & more powerful than what they really were. In reality, they were very stoppable & vulnerable in the beginnings. But too many people were too afraid to take them on - exactly what they wanted people to believe.
We were talking about the hope of winning them over, "converting them". Not, whether we could conquer them militarily or not.
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SurSteven:
Andy_Shofar:
SurSteven:
al Sabah:
love2travel:
I always wondered...for all of the money spent on war and military. Couldn't the just give everyone a house, car, food and a four day work week. Would people except that alternative over fighting? Something like an incentive program. I know it sounds a bit mad, but wouldn't it be nice to not have fighting in your neighborhood, and not to have to worry about your children? Would you choose to have the house car and food neighborhood, or would you choose to live in the fighting each other neighborhood? A bit simplistic, I know...but with the money spent....surely there could be better incentives.
Winning hearts and minds might work when disputes are over economics and privilege, but how do you win over a group that wants your extinction?
everyone is thinking the same thing
I believe that's exactly what they want "everyone" to believe. It's been said historically that Hitler's Nazi (mobster/bully) group was really small in the beginnings - but they pretended to be bigger & more powerful than what they really were. In reality, they were very stoppable & vulnerable in the beginnings. But too many people were too afraid to take them on - exactly what they wanted people to believe.
We were talking about the hope of winning them over, "converting them". Not, whether we could conquer them militarily or not.
If they want a house, they will take a house. If they want a car, they will take a car. If they want a head ... They are not interested in peace talk, world peace, songs, or lectures, ... They will take money for the time being - but that won't stop them ...
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What did you mean by this then? "I believe that's exactly what they want "everyone" to believe."
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SurSteven:
What did you mean by this then? "I believe that's exactly what they want "everyone" to believe."
I believe they are stoppable - the hard core Nazi's from WWII were not "convertible" but they were stoppable. History bears this out. They (the terrorists) want people to believe that they are not stoppable - to believe the opposite (that they are not stoppable), in my view is an error. V.P. Joe Bidden seems to share this view - sounds a bit like General Patton ??
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i married isis on the 5th day of may...but i couldn't hold on to her very long we kill them...because they kill us and they kill us...because we kill them and there are no sins...inside the gates of eden
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Andy_Shofar:
Is there any major news agency that says anything otherwise??? Jimmy Carter to Headline Fundraiser for Hamas Front Group http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/Jimmy-Carter-Fundraiser-Hamas/2014/08/28/id/591451/?ns_mail_uid=1502173&ns_mail_job=1583614_08282014&s=al&dkt_nbr=8aair1ak
This article is misleading. Mr Carter spoke at an organization for Muslim Americans. He has, however, called for the legitimization of Hamas. That is very disappointing since he claims to support the people of Palestine.
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Andy_Shofar:
I believe that's exactly what they want "everyone" to believe. It's been said historically that Hitler's Nazi (mobster/bully) group was really small in the beginnings - but they pretended to be bigger & more powerful than what they really were. In reality, they were very stoppable & vulnerable in the beginnings. But too many people were too afraid to take them on - exactly what they wanted people to believe.
I'm afraid I do not understand what it is you are trying to say here.
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Andy_Shofar:
SurSteven:
What did you mean by this then? "I believe that's exactly what they want "everyone" to believe."
I believe they are stoppable - the hard core Nazi's from WWII were not "convertible" but they were stoppable. History bears this out. They (the terrorists) want people to believe that they are not stoppable - to believe the opposite (that they are not stoppable), in my view is an error. V.P. Joe Bidden seems to share this view - sounds a bit like General Patton ??
For once, the nazi analogy holds true, but not for the reason most people assume. There are still nazis around today. You don't have to look too far to find them. But the good thing is that they're seen for the pathetic throwbacks they are. We don't go re-starting World War 2 every time dickhead paints a swastika on a Synagogue, do we? That would just make these losers more important than they are, and cause far more suffering among innocents. Everyone knows that. The same goes for every other group of fringe-dwelling extremists. There are always going to be some but they should never made out to be more important than they are. http://www.smh.com.au/comment/tony-abbotts-is-intervention-bluster-muffles-civil-unrest-in-australia-20140905-10cgc3.html#ixzz3CSk2FoIh
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audi:
"Love thy enemy." [Ten Commandments, The Holy Bible] Author: (it's complicated)
Yeah, um, nah. Love Thine Enemy is not one of the Ten Commandments. That's pretty easy to look up. It's a New Testament thing. Good advice still, but quotes should be accurately attributed. Nice touch on 'it's complicated,' though.
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Am thinking that "complex" may be a more fitting word. And that, the basic simple "truths of life" are only made complex because people create divided and denominationalized beliefs, rituals and practices/religions around them. It is all extremely simple when observed at it's basic common core. "Love is thee answer...and You know that!...for sure!" ~ //oo\\
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al Sabah:
Andy_Shofar:
I believe that's exactly what they want "everyone" to believe. It's been said historically that Hitler's Nazi (mobster/bully) group was really small in the beginnings - but they pretended to be bigger & more powerful than what they really were. In reality, they were very stoppable & vulnerable in the beginnings. But too many people were too afraid to take them on - exactly what they wanted people to believe.
I'm afraid I do not understand what it is you are trying to say here.
The "they" used above refers to ISIL and/or ISIS. Comparing them the Nazi's in their early stages is (I believe) fair. The are still stoppable - at least I think so. They are masters at pretending to be more powerful a military force than what they really are.
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isis ~ dylan (slowed down)
gates of eden ~ dylan Anyone who thinks that religious...economic...and political differences...can be resolved through violence...are lost...and need to come back home -
The Nazis could have indeed been easily stopped had some military acted earlier. In contrast, Isis cannot be stopped by American-style military campaigns. You cannot fight a terrorist organization as you would fight a national army. It fails and often leads to new and stronger terrorist groups. Isis is itself a direct result of failed military campaigns. Terrorists can and will be stopped, but not by armies and drones. The United States would be wise to listen to Saudi Arabia and Israel for once. Isis could be eliminated by the end of the year. Unfortunately, the United States will follow its usual pattern and conduct a conventional war that will drag on for decades. Eventually, the weapons given to the enemies of America's enemies will be used yet again against the United States and its allies.
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al Sabah:
The Nazis could have indeed been easily stopped had some military acted earlier. In contrast, Isis cannot be stopped by American-style military campaigns. You cannot fight a terrorist organization as you would fight a national army. It fails and often leads to new and stronger terrorist groups. Isis is itself a direct result of failed military campaigns. Terrorists can and will be stopped, but not by armies and drones. The United States would be wise to listen to Saudi Arabia and Israel for once. Isis could be eliminated by the end of the year. Unfortunately, the United States will follow its usual pattern and conduct a conventional war that will drag on for decades. Eventually, the weapons given to the enemies of America's enemies will be used yet again against the United States and its allies.
I mostly agree, however I believe the Nazi's were a German type of terrorist/religious cult. They were not a typical military organization in it's beginnings. Hitler was a deity sort of person at the head of this terrorist, religious cult. They became a recognized, accepted power by first creating fear in the lives of anyone who would dare oppose them (but they still were a religious, fanatical cult).
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al Sabah:
The Nazis could have indeed been easily stopped had some military acted earlier. In contrast, Isis cannot be stopped by American-style military campaigns. You cannot fight a terrorist organization as you would fight a national army. It fails and often leads to new and stronger terrorist groups. Isis is itself a direct result of failed military campaigns. Terrorists can and will be stopped, but not by armies and drones. The United States would be wise to listen to Saudi Arabia and Israel for once. Isis could be eliminated by the end of the year. Unfortunately, the United States will follow its usual pattern and conduct a conventional war that will drag on for decades. Eventually, the weapons given to the enemies of America's enemies will be used yet again against the United States and its allies.
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SurSteven:
isis ~ dylan (slowed down)
gates of eden ~ dylan Anyone who thinks that religious...economic...and political differences...can be resolved through violence...are lost...and need to come back home -
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You must have made that cartoon at the end of the Bush administration when the economy was on the verge of collapse and OBL was still at large 7 years after 911. Now, of course, the stock market is at record highs and OBL is long gone...thanks to "democratic" mindedness. Vote? Vote Indeed!
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SurSteven:
You must have made that cartoon at the end of the Bush administration when the economy was on the verge of collapse and OBL was still at large 7 years after 911. Now, of course, the stock market is at record highs and OBL is long gone...thanks to "democratic" mindedness. Vote? Vote Indeed!
I just did the cartoon this week. Just about Any politician in general - no one in particular. I am sure that if you don't read the words Or make up your own, it can say anything That you want it to say. Thoughts of politicians being this way Have been around for many years at all Levels.