Could the new Kanye/McCartney single All Day be his best?
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RMartinez:
brettb3:
The fact that this collaboration seems to upset, even almost offend, so many Paul fans is all the more reason for him to have done it in my mind. Good for him for having an open mind, and for challenging himself to do something different.
People here, from what I have read, are not offended or upset, they just don't think it is that great or reflective of Paul's work. As far as using the "N" word in a so-called song, we are supposed to be offended by that. I see people being offended at that as a good thing and would hope people of all backgrounds will be against that.
"As far as using the "N" word in a so-called song, we are supposed to be offended by that. I see people being offended at that as a good thing and would hope people of all backgrounds will be against that." I know I mentioned it several times and think it is a disgrace. IMO - it is like Mr. McCartney is saying it is no big deal to use that word.
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yankeefan7:
Shawn:
I honestly thought Paul was better than all this. These days, for the first time, I am questioning my assessment of the situation. These "collaborations", the same old set list, the weak vocal performances... Maybe I'm overreacting, but it's all making me feel a little sad. I'm truly sorry to be so negative, but I just don't see the good in this. Not this time.
I agree, it looks like he is desperate to be on the charts since he can't do it with his solo work IMO. The man is in his 70's so vocal performances are not going to get better. If he wants to continue and not become a laughing stock he will need to choose his songs better or change the arrangement.
I think the goal is to get his solo stuff back on radio-programmers' radar. These collabs are merely Phase I to achieve that.
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RMartinez:
Bruce M.:
RMartinez:
Young people always think their music and styles are better than older generations. That is normal. But what happened in the 50s and 60s was unlike anything going on today. Kanye West is good at what he does. But he is no Elvis Presley. That is just ludicris!
By definition what happened 50-60 years ago isn't like what's happening today. That's about as insightful as saying that gravity makes stuff fall. What's the significance of any piece of popular culture typically isn't clear for decades -- just as the significance of Elvis and the Beatles was not clear to 98% of society back then. An awful lot of seemingly intelligent people dismissed them as fads who'd be forgotten in two years. The judgements of adults regarding youth culture are almost always laughably wrong in retrospect, which is why I prefer to reserve judgement.
You can reserve judgment all you like. But history is on my side, not yours. Kanye West isn't some huge phenomenon some of us might be mistaking to be a flash in the pan. He has been around for years and it is pretty clear what his role is in music in this era. And it is nothing like what Elvis or the Beatles were like in their day. Period. Neither is U2 for that matter, and they are debatably much bigger and more famous than Kanye. To keep arguing Kanye West is this generation's Elvis or Beatles the way you keep doing is pretty simplistic. If that's the case, then so is Justin Bieber based on what I perceive to be a pretty feeble argument on your part.
"To keep arguing Kanye West is this generation's Elvis or Beatles the way you keep doing is pretty simplistic. If that's the case, then so is Justin Bieber based on what I perceive to be a pretty feeble argument on your part." Exactly. I know most of us will not be around in 30-40 years but I would be absolutely shocked if anybody cares about Kanye then - lol.
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audi:
yankeefan7:
Shawn:
I honestly thought Paul was better than all this. These days, for the first time, I am questioning my assessment of the situation. These "collaborations", the same old set list, the weak vocal performances... Maybe I'm overreacting, but it's all making me feel a little sad. I'm truly sorry to be so negative, but I just don't see the good in this. Not this time.
I agree, it looks like he is desperate to be on the charts since he can't do it with his solo work IMO. The man is in his 70's so vocal performances are not going to get better. If he wants to continue and not become a laughing stock he will need to choose his songs better or change the arrangement.
I think the goal is to get his solo stuff back on radio-programmers' radar. These collabs are merely Phase I to achieve that.
OK, if that happens then maybe they would be a good thing after all - lol. Unfortnately, there is no Phase 1 to achieve more solo songs played at his concerts - lma0 !!!
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yankeefan7:
RMartinez:
Bruce M.:
RMartinez:
Young people always think their music and styles are better than older generations. That is normal. But what happened in the 50s and 60s was unlike anything going on today. Kanye West is good at what he does. But he is no Elvis Presley. That is just ludicris!
By definition what happened 50-60 years ago isn't like what's happening today. That's about as insightful as saying that gravity makes stuff fall. What's the significance of any piece of popular culture typically isn't clear for decades -- just as the significance of Elvis and the Beatles was not clear to 98% of society back then. An awful lot of seemingly intelligent people dismissed them as fads who'd be forgotten in two years. The judgements of adults regarding youth culture are almost always laughably wrong in retrospect, which is why I prefer to reserve judgement.
You can reserve judgment all you like. But history is on my side, not yours. Kanye West isn't some huge phenomenon some of us might be mistaking to be a flash in the pan. He has been around for years and it is pretty clear what his role is in music in this era. And it is nothing like what Elvis or the Beatles were like in their day. Period. Neither is U2 for that matter, and they are debatably much bigger and more famous than Kanye. To keep arguing Kanye West is this generation's Elvis or Beatles the way you keep doing is pretty simplistic. If that's the case, then so is Justin Bieber based on what I perceive to be a pretty feeble argument on your part.
"To keep arguing Kanye West is this generation's Elvis or Beatles the way you keep doing is pretty simplistic. If that's the case, then so is Justin Bieber based on what I perceive to be a pretty feeble argument on your part." Exactly. I know most of us will not be around in 30-40 years but I would be absolutely shocked if anybody cares about Kanye then - lol.
I'm no Kanye fan, but he's going to be a perennial fixture in pop culture.
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audi:
yankeefan7:
Shawn:
I honestly thought Paul was better than all this. These days, for the first time, I am questioning my assessment of the situation. These "collaborations", the same old set list, the weak vocal performances... Maybe I'm overreacting, but it's all making me feel a little sad. I'm truly sorry to be so negative, but I just don't see the good in this. Not this time.
I agree, it looks like he is desperate to be on the charts since he can't do it with his solo work IMO. The man is in his 70's so vocal performances are not going to get better. If he wants to continue and not become a laughing stock he will need to choose his songs better or change the arrangement.
I think the goal is to get his solo stuff back on radio-programmers' radar. These collabs are merely Phase I to achieve that.
BTW - being a man of color, what was your feeling about Mr. McCartney being part of a song that used the N word many times?
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yankeefan7:
audi:
yankeefan7:
Shawn:
I honestly thought Paul was better than all this. These days, for the first time, I am questioning my assessment of the situation. These "collaborations", the same old set list, the weak vocal performances... Maybe I'm overreacting, but it's all making me feel a little sad. I'm truly sorry to be so negative, but I just don't see the good in this. Not this time.
I agree, it looks like he is desperate to be on the charts since he can't do it with his solo work IMO. The man is in his 70's so vocal performances are not going to get better. If he wants to continue and not become a laughing stock he will need to choose his songs better or change the arrangement.
I think the goal is to get his solo stuff back on radio-programmers' radar. These collabs are merely Phase I to achieve that.
OK, if that happens then maybe they would be a good thing after all - lol. Unfortnately, there is no Phase 1 to achieve more solo songs played at his concerts - lma0 !!!
"ZING!"
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yankeefan7:
audi:
yankeefan7:
Shawn:
I honestly thought Paul was better than all this. These days, for the first time, I am questioning my assessment of the situation. These "collaborations", the same old set list, the weak vocal performances... Maybe I'm overreacting, but it's all making me feel a little sad. I'm truly sorry to be so negative, but I just don't see the good in this. Not this time.
I agree, it looks like he is desperate to be on the charts since he can't do it with his solo work IMO. The man is in his 70's so vocal performances are not going to get better. If he wants to continue and not become a laughing stock he will need to choose his songs better or change the arrangement.
I think the goal is to get his solo stuff back on radio-programmers' radar. These collabs are merely Phase I to achieve that.
BTW - being a man of color, what was your feeling about Mr. McCartney being part of a song that used the N word many times?
Since Macca has stepped into Kanye's world, he's just rolling with it. I never use the term, but -- then again -- my lifestyle is more mainstream than "urban." It's not really a part of my immediate culture. While there is some truth that black Americans reclaimed "n-i-g-g-a" to diffuse its historically racist intent, I'm afraid that the point has become lost -- the term's continued use is now chipping away at the esteem of lower-income black America. It's doing the exact opposite of what blacks in the '70s intended*. As for McCartney: If nothing else, it's got folks talking. There's no such thing as bad publicity. *="saggin" is that n-word spelled backwards. And that is NOT a coincidence.
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"Since Macca has stepped into Kanye's world, he's just rolling with it." Exactly what I feel. Where I come from has the N word little meaning, it's just a word, I was not thinking about it negatively before I saw the comments here. I remember in the 80s when hip hop was new you had the band N.W.A. (Niggaz Wit Attitudes) for example. What I learned was that it was ok for black people to use it. I also worked in a record store in the 90s and this word was like a part of Amercian hip hop culture.
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RMartinez:
brettb3:
The fact that this collaboration seems to upset, even almost offend, so many Paul fans is all the more reason for him to have done it in my mind. Good for him for having an open mind, and for challenging himself to do something different.
People here, from what I have read, are not offended or upset, they just don't think it is that great or reflective of Paul's work. As far as using the "N" word in a so-called song, we are supposed to be offended by that. I see people being offended at that as a good thing and would hope people of all backgrounds will be against that.
Sure, you would be offended if you didn't know the history of African Americans subverting the meaning of that word. Rappers have been using that word in hip hop songs for over 30 years.
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Well, I like the 37 final seconds
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brettb3:
RMartinez:
brettb3:
The fact that this collaboration seems to upset, even almost offend, so many Paul fans is all the more reason for him to have done it in my mind. Good for him for having an open mind, and for challenging himself to do something different.
People here, from what I have read, are not offended or upset, they just don't think it is that great or reflective of Paul's work. As far as using the "N" word in a so-called song, we are supposed to be offended by that. I see people being offended at that as a good thing and would hope people of all backgrounds will be against that.
Sure, you would be offended if you didn't know the history of African Americans subverting the meaning of that word. Rappers have been using that word in hip hop songs for over 30 years.
I don't care who uses it or for what reason. I am perfectly aware of how some African Americans have come to use it. That is their business. That doesn't mean I get to use it or even want to. It is offensive. My point is that it is the only thing some folks find offensive about Paul's working with West on this most recent recording. They have expressed it here multiple times. That it is in a hip hop song has zero value to me. They can keep doing it and I can keep not listening to it. Even if Paul is on the recording.
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I am afraid Paul is reaching new lows. Disappointing, and perplexing, really.
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RMartinez:
brettb3:
RMartinez:
brettb3:
The fact that this collaboration seems to upset, even almost offend, so many Paul fans is all the more reason for him to have done it in my mind. Good for him for having an open mind, and for challenging himself to do something different.
People here, from what I have read, are not offended or upset, they just don't think it is that great or reflective of Paul's work. As far as using the "N" word in a so-called song, we are supposed to be offended by that. I see people being offended at that as a good thing and would hope people of all backgrounds will be against that.
Sure, you would be offended if you didn't know the history of African Americans subverting the meaning of that word. Rappers have been using that word in hip hop songs for over 30 years.
I don't care who uses it or for what reason. I am perfectly aware of how some African Americans have come to use it. That is their business. That doesn't mean I get to use it or even want to. It is offensive. My point is that it is the only thing some folks find offensive about Paul's working with West on this most recent recording. They have expressed it here multiple times. That it is in a hip hop song has zero value to me. They can keep doing it and I can keep not listening to it. Even if Paul is on the recording.
There have been a couple of white NFL players who thought because they heard black players use the term it was ok, They found out differently when they used it. Google the name Riley Cooper and Kerry Collins to see what I mean.
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I grew up in the south, and I went to school with and had many, many white friends. It amused me more than it did anger me when a friend's dad would greet me with the occasional "What's happenin', my brother?." I knew that they were trying to, let's say, relate. But, no -- white folks using the "n-word" (in either incarnation) directly at black folks is ill-advised.
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I will not claim me to be a specialist in hip hop, I'm more melody than rhythm, so it is not the genre I've heard the most, but still a bit .. and it is a style of music with its own language, I think it's very direct, not only the n ord, but words like bitch and mother*****... you hear it all the time, a choice of words that you might not hear so often in pop and rock, but which now pops up in a McCartney association, because he is experimenting with a fushion of McCartney and the hip hop of Kanye West.
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audi:
I grew up in the south, and I went to school with and had many, many white friends. It amused me more than it did anger me when a friend's dad would greet me with the occasional "What's happenin', my brother?." I knew that they were trying to, let's ay, relate. But, no -- white folks using the "n-word" (in either incarnation) directly at black folks is ill-advised.
Spot on! With everything you said.
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I tend to agree more with Spike Lee. The term is degrading and dehumanizing no matter who uses it. We should remember the history of the word, I think. He showed this effectively in the film Bamboozled. I'm not trying to stir up unnecessary debate, or get off topic, but I find this new song simplistic, sensationalist, and from a songwriting/recording perspective, downright dreadful. Just my two cents...
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Hendrix Ibsen:
I will not claim me to be a specialist in hip hop, I'm more melody than rhythm, so it is not the genre I've heard the most, but still a bit .. and it is a style of music with its own language, I think it's very direct, not only the n ord, but words like bitch and mother*****... you hear it all the time, a choice of words that you might not hear so often in pop and rock, but which now pops up in a McCartney association, because he is experimenting with a fushion of McCartney and the hip hop of Kanye West.
I don't want to hear those words in music either. I mean, to say "ain't it a bitch" is one thing, but to call a woman that in a recording is disgusting and I look down on it. I don't care what the cultural context is. That is an element of culture worth losing. Like beating a woman. Yes, it used to be culturally acceptable. So what? It needs to go away.
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On the other hand, the word queer has been successfully "reclaimed" by the LGBTQ community in a positive way, at least here in parts of Canada. So who knows? The history of the two terms is quite distinct, however, as are the respective histories of oppression and discrimination so... The term in question here still doesn't sit right with me. Far be it from me to tell other artists which words are poetry, and which words are not. But I'm a middle aged white man, and we always think we have all the answers.
Either way, I wish Paul would have chosen a more worthy collaborator - so many to choose from, from any country, race, gender, and musical genre. But Paul is a grown man, and I'm sure he is capable of making his own decisions
