George's criticisms of Macca
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moptops:
Not having John and George around gives Paul freedom not to do but to say what he wants, with regards Beatles legacy, largely unopposed. Ringo is too nice or not interested to engage him. Although he did say something recently along the lines of "Paul thinks he's the only living Beatle..." So even Ringo can get a jibe in. At the 50th anniversary concert it is Ringo who first acknowledges John and George - then Paul follows with what sounds to me, "oh yes, I'd better say something about them too!" Criticism can be good. And on occasion, criticism of Paul is absolutely warranted: absolutely.
My guess is they agreed which one of them would verbalize their tribute to John and George before they performed. To think they wouldn't say something about the other two doesn't make sense, to me anyway.
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Erik in NJ:
moptops:
Not having John and George around gives Paul freedom not to do but to say what he wants, with regards Beatles legacy, largely unopposed. Ringo is too nice or not interested to engage him. Although he did say something recently along the lines of "Paul thinks he's the only living Beatle..." So even Ringo can get a jibe in. At the 50th anniversary concert it is Ringo who first acknowledges John and George - then Paul follows with what sounds to me, "oh yes, I'd better say something about them too!" Criticism can be good. And on occasion, criticism of Paul is absolutely warranted: absolutely.
You can't really blame Paul for trying to set the record straight on a lot of things as perhaps most aptly pointed out in the lyric: Now everybody seems to have their own opinion Who did this and who did that As one of the better and more even-handed Beatle historians, Lewisohn most recently points out that even the four Beatles sometimes all had different recollections on the same thing. Lennon, it would seem, was often wrong about things he "recalled" -- he had a hard time remembering the names of his own songs mistakenly calling "Glass Onion" "Green Onion" in his Playboy interview before the shooting. For example, Paul for years insisted that he'd sung backing vocals on "Come Together"...John and the others denied it. It wasn't until they analyzed the individual tracks for RockBand that Paul was in fact correct! Lennon as we all know so well had this reputation of being the "avant-gard creative genius" behind the Beatles and after his untimely death that myth grew exponentially. The facts bear out that in many cases Paul was really more of an "avant-gard creative genius" than John and it must be difficult having to live with the "Saint Lennon" myth, much of it orchestrated by Yoko. Of course, the flip side of the coin is that John is not here to correct the record and give credit where credit is due. Not unlike Denny Laine, I feel that George and Ringo always felt they were overshadowed by McCartney and Lennon--and they were--who wouldn't have been?!?!. Like Denny Laine it leads to bitterness and resentment. Paul to his credit I think has been the least critical of the others in the press. So I have no problem with Paul trying to set the record straight. I think if he's trying to change facts that history and the wealth of information we now have on the Beatles will correct that and it will show him in a bad light. But for the most part Paul is "spot on" with things that he remembers and I for one am glad that he still with us, making music, and trying to set the record straight on who did what, etc. I have to say that in all of the interviews I have heard as of late he has been quite complimentary towards John in particular and he has said many nice things about George as well.
Not thinking that any of them is either an angel or the opposite in saying this b/c no one has a perfect memory, but having been a heroin addict (John) and an alcoholic (Ringo) and a preaching but non-practicing love-person to his first wife (George--if Pattie's book is accurate he carried on an affair with Ringo's first wife while Pattie was in the house on more than one occasion) , my money is on Paul.
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Here's a very entertaining radio interview in which Paul addresses a few of the points in this discussion. I kept it because it's VERY funny and unusual in that Paul seems completely relaxed and unguarded with this interviewer. I don't blame him for trying to set the record straight on some of his personal history. I know that I would feel as he does considering the wealth of misinformation that is floating around about Paul McCartney and the rest of the Beatles!! Enjoy! http://www.absoluteradio.co.uk/player/Paul-McCartney/10541/Interview.html
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Erik in NJ:
KO, Thanks for the context. I'm quite interested in the middle three lines--is he saying that Paul made him a big star and that he was in the right place at the right time. In the third line it seems that he's complaining about money again...not unusual for George. Good ol' George...I find a certain irony in his preaching about the "material world" and then buying the ostentatious Friar Park Mansion which was perhaps the biggest of the Beatle estates at the time. I'd read an article about George in his latter years still being quite bitter about money (not having enough) and the British tax system. I give Paul and Linda so much credit for living on that farm in Scotland during those years. Now that was a fairly spartan existence and it seems they were closer to practicing what George was preaching. Maybe he should have been more true to himself and he would have been a happier man.
I don't think he was an unhappy man. In fact I'd have rather had a beer with George than with Paul.
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Off topic... or maybe not. I really wish Jane Asher would write a book about her experiences being around Paul and the Beatles. A part of me suspects that she has written some kind of memoir but has told her family not to publish it until X amount of years after she's passed. Probably more hope from me than anything else, though.
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unclesox:
Off topic... or maybe not. I really wish Jane Asher would write a book about her experiences being around Paul and the Beatles. A part of me suspects that she has written some kind of memoir but has told her family not to publish it until X amount of years after she's passed. Probably more hope from me than anything else, though.
Yeah, really OT, but I agree with you. Would make for a fascinating read. She's one who has never said a word about anything. When they split up, all she said (on July 20, 196 was that the engagement was off.
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Like Freda Kelley I think it shows some class to not talk although I must admit I'd be a buyer of her book. Of course she was in a much better financial position than Freda which speaks even more for Freda's integrity
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unclesox:
Off topic... or maybe not. I really wish Jane Asher would write a book about her experiences being around Paul and the Beatles. A part of me suspects that she has written some kind of memoir but has told her family not to publish it until X amount of years after she's passed. Probably more hope from me than anything else, though.
Or maybe x amount of years after Paul's passed.
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oobu24:
unclesox:
Off topic... or maybe not. I really wish Jane Asher would write a book about her experiences being around Paul and the Beatles. A part of me suspects that she has written some kind of memoir but has told her family not to publish it until X amount of years after she's passed. Probably more hope from me than anything else, though.
Or maybe x amount of years after Paul's passed.
Yeah, that's probably it. I hope I'm still around then!
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luigiram:
I find it strange how George Harrison always went out of his way to knock Paul down in interviews for being "selfish" about recording his songs first and about the "ego" within the band.. But when you look at the last 2-3 of the Beatles recordings, you can see and hear Paul's contributions to George's songs and John hardly played on any of them!!! If you read Tony Bramwell's book Magical Mystery Tours, the big arguement between George and Paul was spurred on by Yoko irritating George and him taking it out on Paul.. If you read some of their interviews after like 1971, George, not John is the one who gave Paul the most crap.. John was usually quite complimentary towards Macca after 1971.. Even on the **** Cavett show he referred to Paul as his "best friend" and Yoko agreed... There's a video from like 1987 or 88 from MTV I think on You Tube where during an interview , George was asked about Paul saying he wanted to do some Lennon songs live, to which he responded.. "he's probably run out of good ones of his own"... This from a guy who did a 12 song set on tour in 1974 and included a cover of "In My Life" and a Dylan cover of "If Not For You", that was crap, Paul would have done anything for George.
There is some truth to what you say, but I believe you are making it appear somewhat out of context. I mean we have perhaps 10-20 remarks and jibes by George about Paul in the press over a 30 year span, maybe 15 minutes out of Harrison's life over a 30 year period. What about all the nice things Harrison said about McCartney, what about his kind remarks about the song "I'm Carrying" from the Rolling Stone interview in 79 to promote the George Harrison 79 album. Harrison was possibly the most sarcastic of the Beatles, going back as far the I don't Like Your Tie remark to George Martin in 1962. A lot of the things Harrison said, were done sarcastically rather tongue in cheek. Harrison made the same type of caustic or sarcastic remarks about Lennon and others. He said of Lennon's and the Beatles Free As A Bird, in Australia shortly after the Beatles reunion " I hope somebody does that with all my crap demo's and turns them into hit songs" Having said all that, Harrison certainly did seem to harbor some resentment about Paul, probably some jealousy, but I think much of it comes from The lawsuit where McCartney sued the other three Beatles in open court, airing all their dirty laundry. I think it comes from his releasing the McCartney album in direct competiton to the Let It Be album. I also think Harrison has stated quite clearly in Anthology he said "There was a lot of ego in that band, some of those songs should have just been elbowed aside" Harrison was talking about, in the context of, some of his songs never made later Beatles albums, but granny songs like Maxwells Silver Hammer or Honey Pie did, and I think Harrison resented getting a few more of his songs recorded in the Beatles. At least in the last few years, say from Revolver or Pepper onward. But I think they did love each other, I think Harrison loved McCartney very much, but I think he also did harbor some resentments about what he once called " Economy class Beatle" he said that he and Ringo were treated like the second class Beatles. I think there is some truth to that. You may not like it, but some of Harrisons emotional scars may have been justified. Having said all that, in later years, they played, they recorded, they had dinner together, with and without Ringo, they wrote at least one song together, they jammed, they hung out. A lot of it was just Harrison being sarcastic, I think it's all blown out of Proportion. You know a lot of people were thrilled to play and record with George Harrison, without feeling the need to call him a "Little" brother. McCartney has a pretty big ego, maybe he hurt Harrisons feelings, maybe Jeff Lynne, Bob Dylan, maybe they treated him more like an equal and less like a little brother, who needed to be minded
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Haven't read this entire thread, so my apologies if someone has already mentioned this. You have to remember that Paul knew George first of all the Beatles - even before he met John - so that friendship goes back a long way. Whatever George may have said in the press, when it came down to it he and Paul were friends.
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whobeatle:
McCartney has a pretty big ego
Ya think?!!
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graystoke:
whobeatle:
McCartney has a pretty big ego
Ya think?!!
And rightly so, no? He's perhaps the greatest musician/composer of the last 150 years! I think of all the Beatles he comes across as the most down to Earth and likeable in interviews. He never criticices the other Beatles, is always rather happy and upbeat, no ascerbic or sarcastic tendencies when he speaks, and is he is also quite modest in interviews. I'll take a Paul interview over any of the other Beatles any day.
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whobeatle:
Harrison was talking about, in the context of, some of his songs never made later Beatles albums, but granny songs like Maxwells Silver Hammer or Honey Pie did, and I think Harrison resented [not] getting a few more of his songs recorded in the Beatles. At least in the last few years, say from Revolver or Pepper onward.
Well they had an agreement that George would get two songs on an album and Ringo one (if he wanted it). Maxwell and Honey Pie were much superior songs to most of what Harrison had to offer. Harrison started writing all of those spiritual and existential songs and they just were not in step with was wanted on the Beatles albums. He and Ringo were in "Economy Class" in the Beatles because their song writing as "Economy Class" for all intents and purposes. "Something" and "Here Comes The Sun" are always touted as such brilliant Harrison tunes, but Paul could write songs like this and better in his sleep! And it wasn't as if George was in the studio coming up with all these brilliant ideas to make John's and Paul's songs better the way Paul did. He and Ringo both did a pretty good job of basically doing what they had to on songs. I certainly think you see more creative Harrison guitar licks on earlier Beatles songs than the latter. It's almost as if Harrison regressed as a guitarist as the years went on. His voice got worse and he could never get himself away from that annoying slide guitar. Listen to how good his voice was in "If I Needed Someone" and "Don't Bother Me" and his tight guitar in songs like "I Feel Fine".
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Erik in NJ:
graystoke:
whobeatle:
McCartney has a pretty big ego
Ya think?!!
And rightly so, no? He's perhaps the greatest musician/composer of the last 150 years! I think of all the Beatles he comes across as the most down to Earth and likeable in interviews. He never criticices the other Beatles, is always rather happy and upbeat, no ascerbic or sarcastic tendencies when he speaks, and is he is also quite modest in interviews. I'll take a Paul interview over any of the other Beatles any day.
Some have called McCartney manipulative and not so open because of that. I enjoy McCartney interviews, but always found John to be more sincere and down to earth. Really, none of them come across badly, they were all pretty down to earth people, and watching the Anthology, you get the idea they were more similar than different. He may be one of the greatest composers of the last 50 years, up there with John Lennon. The last 150 years is a stretch!
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RMartinez:
He may be one of the greatest composers of the last 50 years, up there with John Lennon. The last 150 years is a stretch!
Not really! Now if he'd said 200 years that would include Beethoven, but even then, I think Paul is right up there (with John Lennon of course)
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Some have called McCartney manipulative and not so open because of that.
I'm not quite sure how being positive translates into being manipulative. Some of the interviews John gave after the Beatles were downright nasty. He seemed to have mellowed out as the years wore on though.
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graystoke:
whobeatle:
McCartney has a pretty big ego
Ya think?!!
How big? Ah hang on...how long's a piece of string?
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RMartinez:
Erik in NJ:
graystoke:
whobeatle:
McCartney has a pretty big ego
Ya think?!!
And rightly so, no? He's perhaps the greatest musician/composer of the last 150 years! I think of all the Beatles he comes across as the most down to Earth and likeable in interviews. He never criticices the other Beatles, is always rather happy and upbeat, no ascerbic or sarcastic tendencies when he speaks, and is he is also quite modest in interviews. I'll take a Paul interview over any of the other Beatles any day.
Some have called McCartney manipulative and not so open because of that. I enjoy McCartney interviews, but always found John to be more sincere and down to earth. Really, none of them come across badly, they were all pretty down to earth people, and watching the Anthology, you get the idea they were more similar than different. He may be one of the greatest composers of the last 50 years, up there with John Lennon. The last 150 years is a stretch!
Only very very rarely in interviews have I seen Paul drop his guard... Here is real Paul at 1.11...everthing before that is Paul in his performance mode...
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If we were to list the top ten messengers of love in human history...george and paul would be there. Who would you say the top 20 are?