The ..2012.... Political thread
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Matthew_Montoya:
Speaking of videos, here's an interesting one put together in support of Obama, recently: Ladies and gentleman, the Obama Youth!
Sort of reminded me of this:i see some democratic minded kids in one video singing about and hoping for some kind of peaceful international resolution.......and then in thee other video i see hometeamism nationalism and selfism
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SurSteven:
i see some democratic minded kids in one video singing about and hoping for some kind of peaceful international resolution.......and then in thee other video i see hometeamism nationalism and selfism
Democratic minded kids? You honestly think that they have a clue about the election? Using kids as props for an election, and I say this regardless of the party who uses it, is sick. And the lyrics... how Obama is gonna bring change, freedom, etc., etc.? It's practically religious like and this is one of my biggest problems with many (again, not all) of the Obama supporters who treat him as this God-like figure.
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YES!
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Matthew_Montoya:
SurSteven:
i see some democratic minded kids in one video singing about and hoping for some kind of peaceful international resolution.......and then in thee other video i see hometeamism nationalism and selfism
Democratic minded kids? You honestly think that they have a clue about the election? Using kids as props for an election, and I say this regardless of the party who uses it, is sick. And the lyrics... how Obama is gonna bring change, freedom, etc., etc.? It's practically religious like and this is one of my biggest problem with many (again, not all) of the Obama supporters who treat him as this God-like figure.
Yes those silly kids. Who do they think they are. Oh ya draft age. Maybe the see the writing on the wall and their scared shitless their going to get drafted if a Rep stays in office.
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Matthew_Montoya:
SurSteven:
i see some democratic minded kids in one video singing about and hoping for some kind of peaceful international resolution.......and then in thee other video i see hometeamism nationalism and selfism
Democratic minded kids? You honestly think that they have a clue about the election? Using kids as props for an election, and I say this regardless of the party who uses it, is sick. And the lyrics... how Obama is gonna bring change, freedom, etc., etc.? It's practically religious like and this is one of my biggest problems with many (again, not all) of the Obama supporters who treat him as this God-like figure.
i am sorry that my response went over your head @ the speed of light squared
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appletart2:
Yes those silly kids. Who do they think they are. Oh ya draft age. Maybe the see the writing on the wall and their scared shitless their going to get drafted if a Rep stays in office.
Yes, that's what every child is thinking: cartoons, school, friends... and getting drafted in a war when they are older. As for a Republican enacting the draft? O.K., let's see... In 1917, President Woodrow Wilson (D) enacted the first Selective Services Act. This required all men 21-30 and then later 18-45 to register for military service. Then, in 1940, the first peacetime draft was enacted by FDR (D), with the Selective Training And Service Act of 1940 then once WWII broke out, another draft was enabled which required all men 18-45 to register for military service, while all men 18-65 were required to register. Between 1940-1947, around 10,000,000 men were inducted. Following this, in 1948, President Harry Truman (D) continued the act with some revisions and then created a new act in 1951 in the wake of the Korean War. Finally, in 1967, we have the Military Services Act, enacted by President Lyndon Johnson (D) which caused a huge uproar in the wake of Vietnam. But let's not fret. Because the draft FINALLY ended in 1973 when it became an all-voluntary thing. The person who ended it? President Richard Nixon... a Republican. Perhaps a history book might be in order for you before you spout off more unsubstantiated claims...
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jaipur:
I'm not sure where this dysfunctionality might stem from : I have not , as you say, ""blurred the distinction between the person or the idea. " .....simply because an opponent recognizes a good point in his opponent's argument, doesn't mean he agrees with it. It also doesn't mean opponents can't find agreement on certain points either. There's no desception or lying on Obama's part in doing so despite your inclination to believe that there is because you seem to be unaware of the nuance between these two.
But, wait a minute, you're changing your argument. The original argument, and where this whole thing originated, was that Obama agreed with McCain. Now you're changing it to that he agrees with just a certain point. That's a very different characterization. And, again, what you're saying doesn't make sense, logically. You're arguing that someone can disagree with a point that he finds good. But that makes no sense. If you find what they're saying to be a good point, then you think they're right. Otherwise, what's good about it? It's bordering on contradiction to say that I think "X" is good and that I also disagree with "X."
jaipur:
Everything is not "black or white", "totally agree, or "totally disagree as many apparently would like to believe any topic ishould be.
So everything is not black and white... except that some things aren't black and white. You're black and white on that.
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This explains McCains role in the current financial crisis.... Keating Economics- John McCain and the makings of a FINANCIAL CRISIS part I http://www.keatingeconomics.com/ I will post the complete documentary when it is released after 12p est today 10/6 bet you can't wait....
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mustangsally10:
This explains McCains role in the current financial crisis.... Keating Economics- John McCain and the makings of a FINANCIAL CRISIS part I http://www.keatingeconomics.com/ I will post the complete documentary when it is released after 12p est today 10/6 bet you can't wait....
UPDATE: You should be able to click the same link above for the documentary. It is having very high usage so may need to keep trying.
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* Disclaimer -- I know that when I walked into this test the floor has a slant to it ...... but it was fun to take their quiz -- if you want to try it - whatever your opinions are -- here it is: http://barackobamatest.com/
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Impressive Obama endorsement from the former chairman & CEO of Bank of America http://www.charlotteobserver.com/406/story/225909.html
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The_Fool:
* Disclaimer -- I know that when I walked into this test the floor has a slant to it ...... but it was fun to take their quiz -- if you want to try it - whatever your opinions are -- here it is: http://barackobamatest.com/
For some reason - the link above is not operational ... I was game, I took a leap ...
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"Because the draft FINALLY ended in 1973 when it became an all-voluntary thing. The person who ended it? President Richard Nixon... a Republican" .......saying that Nixon ended the draft is like saying that Reagan tore down the Berlin Wall.......it was blue jeans, rock n roll and democratic persistence in both cases!
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Matthew_Montoya:
jaipur:
I'm not sure where this dysfunctionality might stem from : I have not , as you say, ""blurred the distinction between the person or the idea. " .....simply because an opponent recognizes a good point in his opponent's argument, doesn't mean he agrees with it. It also doesn't mean opponents can't find agreement on certain points either. There's no desception or lying on Obama's part in doing so despite your inclination to believe that there is because you seem to be unaware of the nuance between these two.
But, wait a minute, you're changing your argument. The original argument, and where this whole thing originated, was that Obama agreed with McCain. Now you're changing it to that he agrees with just a certain point. That's a very different characterization. And, again, what you're saying doesn't make sense, logically. You're arguing that someone can disagree with a point that he finds good. But that makes no sense. If you find what they're saying to be a good point, then you think they're right. Otherwise, what's good about it? It's bordering on contradiction to say that I think "X" is good and that I also disagree with "X." I am not changing the argument at all. You seem to be of the opinion that logic "always" prevails. in humans..it does not. I did not say that Obama agreed with McCain....that was merely your interpretation. And surprise! You're not correct.
jaipur:
Everything is not "black or white", "totally agree, or "totally disagree as many apparently would like to believe any topic ishould be.
So everything is not black and white... except that some things aren't black and white. You're black and white on that.
Too bad the point seems to be beyond your comprehension
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Andy_Shofar:
The_Fool:
* Disclaimer -- I know that when I walked into this test the floor has a slant to it ...... but it was fun to take their quiz -- if you want to try it - whatever your opinions are -- here it is: http://barackobamatest.com/
For some reason - the link above is not operational ... I was game, I took a leap ...
Sorry if it didn't work ..... try the same with www.barackobamatest.com these are fun whether you agree or disagree -- it can still give you an idea where you stand.
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McCain linked to group in Iran-Contra case" Here's the link: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27062761/ We don't need John (He will associate himself with a group with ties to Iran-Contra and worry about its legality later) McCain in the White House. It's no surprise that McCain's new campaign strategy up to the election will be to attack Obama's character, even going so far as calling Obama a "lier". McCain being down in the polls has him resorting to the despiration move of character assassination without looking at himself in the mirror. McCain is out of touch but will stop at nothing to get in the White House. His stance on this useless war and perpetuating tax breaks for the wealthiest Americans have steered him away from issues and on to assaulting the character of his opponent. He even said a few weeks ago that "our economy is in fine shape". : Can you say "economic bailout"? He doesn't even know how many houses he owns! Elizabeth Edwards said last week that she and John McCain, who have both been afflicted with cancer in their lives, have something in common. She said "We both wouldn't be covered by his health care plan." McCain will be more of the same disasterous policies that we have now with the continued disenfranchsement of the midle class. Don't let this happen! Vote Obama/Biden for the change we need in America.
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jaipur:
I am not changing the argument at all. You seem to be of the opinion that logic "always" prevails. in humans..it does not. .
So you're using logic to prove that logic doesn't always prevail... interesting.
jaipur:
Too bad the point seems to be beyond your comprehension
No, it's well within my realm of comprehension, but when you say "everything is not black and white," you completely contradict yourself. That's not missing the point, it's pointing out what it is: a contradiction.
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SurSteven:
.......saying that Nixon ended the draft is like saying that Reagan tore down the Berlin Wall.......it was blue jeans, rock n roll and democratic persistence in both cases!
Again... if it were Democratic persistence that ended it, then please tell me why they started it and keep enacting it. Please.
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Fan Since 1964:
McCain linked to group in Iran-Contra case" Here's the link: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27062761/ We don't need John (He will associate himself with a group with ties to Iran-Contra and worry about its legality later) McCain in the White House.
For starters, the article is not specific on the connections. The only thing that it says is that he was part of a group that was smuggling weapons to the Contras, which doesn't bother me, but the nature of the connection isn't established. This seems to bother you. O.K., fine. But if McCain having non-specific ties to an organization 20 years ago bothers you, then why doesn't the fact that the other candidate has recent and very specific ties and allegiances to terrorist, Bill Ayers? Does that just go out the window? Here's a link back atcha: http://hughhewitt.townhall.com/blog/g/33171af7-e34f-41bc-847b-5d9e0009ec37 What the hell, I'm feeling generous, here's another one: http://hughhewitt.townhall.com/blog/g/12879a55-685f-4b7c-9c11-1fb5f618f937 Funding and aiding people fighting communists vs. fundraising with a guy who planned to kill cops in America... hmmm... I'd say they aren't really comparable.
Fan Since 1964:
It's no surprise that McCain's new campaign strategy up to the election will be to attack Obama's character, even going so far as calling Obama a "lier". McCain being down in the polls has him resorting to the despiration move of character assassination without looking at himself in the mirror.
For starters, it is interesting to see you peer into the hearts and minds of men and just suddenly come up with the motives for their actions, motives which are not backed by any facts or reasoning. Finally, why is telling the truth an act of "desperation?" By saying that it's a character assassination, you're making the claim that the accusations are false. If they are false, then prove it. The burden of proof now lays on you.
Fan Since 1964:
McCain is out of touch but will stop at nothing to get in the White House.
Out of touch from what?
Fan Since 1964:
His stance on this useless war
Liberating millions of people and killing an evil dictator is useless?
Fan Since 1964:
and perpetuating tax breaks for the wealthiest Americans
Right, small businesses are the new rich, I suppose.
Fan Since 1964:
have steered him away from issues and on to assaulting the character of his opponent.
So the Obama/Ayers connection and/or other shady allegiances are merely an irrelevant issue and purely sidestepping the issues? Really? If that's the case, then why post the Iran Contra link? Isn't that also "stepping away" from the issues?
Fan Since 1964:
He doesn't even know how many houses he owns!
I remember when the Obama campaign said something about this. By your reasoning, would this also be characterized as a desperation move by the Obama campaign? Does that mean they're doing whatever they can to get into the White House, too? Also, what's the relevance of this? If you care about McCain forgetting how many houses he has, then why not also care about the time Obama forgot how many states there are in the union?
Fan Since 1964:
Elizabeth Edwards said last week that she and John McCain, who have both been afflicted with cancer in their lives, have something in common. She said "We both wouldn't be covered by his health care plan."
So? Who cares what Elizabeth Edwards has to say? I don't recall the day she became a reliable authority on this. Besides, her husband supports Obama... what else is she going to say?
Fan Since 1964:
McCain will be more of the same disasterous policies that we have now with the continued disenfranchsement of the midle class.
O.K., I'm noticing quite a lot of vaguery. What policies and how are they disenfranchised, at that?
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The_Fool:
* Disclaimer -- I know that when I walked into this test the floor has a slant to it ...... but it was fun to take their quiz -- if you want to try it - whatever your opinions are -- here it is: http://barackobamatest.com/
4. America?s 3.7 million Sub Chapter S corporations, which are small companies with less than 75 stock holders, are currently taxed at a rate of 35%. Do you favor or oppose increasing the tax rate on these businesses to 50.3%? I quit with the test on this question. Sub Chapter S corporations do not have a tax rate. The income or loss flows to the shareholder and is taxed at their tax rate. The test is flawed.