left wing democrats, right wing republicans OR left wing liberals, right wing conservatives......they aren't the same thing.
Posts made by jaipur
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
audi:
SurSteven:
jaipur:
Oh my, the natives are extremely restless on this reservation....I'm not surprised (lol!). When are you folks going to learn? It's neither extreme left, nor extreme right....come to the middle where the rest of us are
Where is the middle between leftwing liberals and rightwing republicans?
That's the question, I reckon. The greatest irony of the debate between the two sides is their common meesage: "Keep government out of our lives."
Name me a president that proposed health care for the elderly by law and cut taxes as well? (liberal/conservative) Name me another president that opened the door to today's globalization and protected the environment as well? (conservative/liberal) Name me another president who cut taxes, yet also protected a key government program that exists today? (conservative/liberal) Name another president that enacted leave for employees, and removed a law mentioned recently in this thread? (liberal/conservative) Oh, and the phrase is actually "right wing conservatives" that goes with "left wing liberals". Note in the examples, and yes they are real, of both principles enacted in governing.....neither 100% liberal, nor 100% conservative....governing in the (wait for it)...M I D D L E. Independents are neither 100% liberal nor 100% conservative....they embraced both.
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
Oh my, the natives are extremely restless on this reservation....I'm not surprised (lol!). When are you folks going to learn? It's neither extreme left, nor extreme right....come to the middle where the rest of us are
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
Conservatives have a place. Disagree all you want. Give a little, get a little.
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
btw that's the way the constitution works.....the supreme court rules whether you agree with the judgment or not. oh, before I forget.....the electoral college elects the president, not the general population.
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
Frankly, I see no wrong in churchs asking for support. I do see misguided notions in those thinking that everything is "free" imo.
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
And the reason churches pass around the collection basket every sunday during services??? just curious...........
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
EADG:
jaipur:
Don't think it's productivity, eadg.....that is quite high and has been for a bit even before 2007. Social security is a bit more fixable than medicare
You may be right about the relative complexity of social security vs medicare. Either way, it seems like congress won't force any major change to either until we reach a point where the votes and contributions of the younger generation outnumber those of the older generation, and then the political logic for some deep cuts in both programs will become irresistable and it will happen and it won't be pretty. Hmmm.....I don't know about that yet. Social Security has a surplus currently. Plus the old geezers are the ones that vote....at least more consistently than the younger folks. The older generation is benefiting from living longer that wasn't part of either program...who knew?? My point about productivity is that the cost of nearly everything is getting cheaper, and technology of one kind or another is behind most of that. (To preemp a comment about WalMart and third world sweatshops being the real reason the cost of goods has stayed so low, that is true for some goods but that is driven in part by technology too, in the form of supply chain management, etc.) The US economy has had a large bubble of productive workers (the baby boom generation) supporting a smaller generation of consumptive retirees, but that is going to invert at some point and the younger generation is going to get stuck supporting a disproportionately large retired class AND paying off the big federal debt. They can't possibly do that without accepting a lower standard of living for themselves, which seems unlikely, unless we get way more productivity per worker (and the younger generation won't give up a share of those productivity gains without a fight, but at least they can generate them there will be something to fight over) or population growth through immigration (and the US will become like a club where you're welcome to join if you can make the cut, but as your prize you get stuck with your share of the debt that the current members have run up). If neither of those things happens, we become like Italy or Japan with an aging population, a stagnant economy, too much debt (in Italy's case) and pretty dreary future for everyone.
**Keep in mind though, that there are quite a large number of old geezers who aren't actually retiring....they are still a productive part of the equation now when that wasn't the case many years ago (meaning they are still earning income most likely part time in their 70s). Also, the folks currently in their sixties aren't living entirely on their retirement income either. Personally, I don't see where the younger generation will be doing all of the heavy lifting in the economy...true, a good share but not all ,simply because the numbers are against them.....more of us then them. Hence, as long as geezers can generate some income they can still contribute and not put all the burden on the smaller, younger folks behind them. You are absolutely spot on regarding technology btw though I am not as pessimistic about the future. good one eadg :**wink:
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
beatlechick:
jaipur:
SurSteven:
jaipur:
SurSteven:
jaipur:
The indians are restless on this reservation The nonsense of deficits....there are "two" kinds, boys and girls...structural (that has existed for umpty dump years....known as social security, medicare) to which grandchildren and great grandchildren will pay) and budget deficits (unemployment). As long as Congress keeps jerking around regarding the Bush tax cuts, businesses CANNOT hire. Because when those cuts expire, companies will need the cash they are currently stashing to pay them This is not about democrats or republican philosophy....it's about where all of us (meaning myself, the wife and others I know) are....it is a little of both......us folks in the center
So, if liberal philosophy is the leftwing philosophy...and republicanism is right hand philosophy...and democracy is the middle and mediating point of view that it always has been..........how does... halfway between the near right and the far right..........become the center? ...it's no wonder that working people are sadly laughing at you....
Working people didn't laugh at Bill Clinton or Tony Blair....both of whom governed from the center. It's no wonder people actually laugh at you instead as that simple fact never occurred to you. It is us folks in the center that swing elections. Not the extremes on either end.
So, "you are" a Democrat! No I am not a democrat or a republican. One more time and do try and read for comprehension: Clinton and Blair governed from the center (neither democrat or republican, nor labor or conservative). ps...please take it easy on the indians...they gave a lot more to this country than you did! :
Yes, where would we be without casinos??
How ignorant. When was the last time you talked to Native Americans and called them indians? When was the last time you read about their various rich history and culture? They don't lose sight of who they are, where they came from like Americans have.
My father in law came from the Wampanoag tribe here in new england. You know the ones that had thanksgiving with the white pilgrims. He didn't mind being called an indian. Native American wasn't part of the vocabulary back then. No need to be so morally indignant or jump to conclusions when there isn't one.
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
Don't think it's productivity, eadg.....that is quite high and has been for a bit even before 2007. Social security is a bit more fixable than medicare
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
SurSteven:
jaipur:
SurSteven:
jaipur:
The indians are restless on this reservation The nonsense of deficits....there are "two" kinds, boys and girls...structural (that has existed for umpty dump years....known as social security, medicare) to which grandchildren and great grandchildren will pay) and budget deficits (unemployment). As long as Congress keeps jerking around regarding the Bush tax cuts, businesses CANNOT hire. Because when those cuts expire, companies will need the cash they are currently stashing to pay them This is not about democrats or republican philosophy....it's about where all of us (meaning myself, the wife and others I know) are....it is a little of both......us folks in the center
So, if liberal philosophy is the leftwing philosophy...and republicanism is right hand philosophy...and democracy is the middle and mediating point of view that it always has been..........how does... halfway between the near right and the far right..........become the center? ...it's no wonder that working people are sadly laughing at you....
Working people didn't laugh at Bill Clinton or Tony Blair....both of whom governed from the center. It's no wonder people actually laugh at you instead as that simple fact never occurred to you. It is us folks in the center that swing elections. Not the extremes on either end.
So, "you are" a Democrat! No I am not a democrat or a republican. One more time and do try and read for comprehension: Clinton and Blair governed from the center (neither democrat or republican, nor labor or conservative). ps...please take it easy on the indians...they gave a lot more to this country than you did! :
Yes, where would we be without casinos??
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
EADG:
mustangsally10:
Andy_Shofar:
mustangsally10:
Altanon:
I wouldn't mind seeing US go back to the Eisenhower-Era Tax rates.
I wouldn't mind it either. Tax rates for the rich under Eisenhower were higher than those proposed by Obama. He also created the greatest federal economic stimulus with the federal highway system since FDR. He was against corporatism and he would be a democrat today...the republicans today would throw him out. hehe...Andy is doubling down with the stupid
Naaa - you just don't want to hear it, so you go for insults You are not so hard to figure out ... You (attempt to) insult everyone to whom you disagree in this thread
I don't disagree with you there is nothing to disagree with. You never discuss issues because you don't know anything about them. You put up posts that have nothing to do with the issues (what matters). You really don't even know what I'm talking about now. It's people like you who got the US into the situation it is now by now knowing anything about the issues...you vote based on crap you read in the national inquirer or whatever junk you read.. Unless you're a multimillionaire you ought to be kissing Obamas feet because he is helping your life everyday with the work he and the democrats are doing. I doubt you even understood what I just wrote.
Why do you constantly demonize "the rich" in your postings?
They have more than sally that's why This is another bush hater who believes that he along with republicans "created this situation". This situation was created by both democrat and republican policies ....simple as that.
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
SurSteven:
jaipur:
The indians are restless on this reservation The nonsense of deficits....there are "two" kinds, boys and girls...structural (that has existed for umpty dump years....known as social security, medicare) to which grandchildren and great grandchildren will pay) and budget deficits (unemployment). As long as Congress keeps jerking around regarding the Bush tax cuts, businesses CANNOT hire. Because when those cuts expire, companies will need the cash they are currently stashing to pay them This is not about democrats or republican philosophy....it's about where all of us (meaning myself, the wife and others I know) are....it is a little of both......us folks in the center
So, if liberal philosophy is the leftwing philosophy...and republicanism is right hand philosophy...and democracy is the middle and mediating point of view that it always has been..........how does... halfway between the near right and the far right..........become the center? ...it's no wonder that working people are sadly laughing at you....
Working people didn't laugh at Bill Clinton or Tony Blair....both of whom governed from the center. It's no wonder people actually laugh at you instead as that simple fact never occurred to you. It is us folks in the center that swing elections. Not the extremes on either end.
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
The indians are restless on this reservation The nonsense of deficits....there are "two" kinds, boys and girls...structural (that has existed for umpty dump years....known as social security, medicare) to which grandchildren and great grandchildren will pay) and budget deficits (unemployment). As long as Congress keeps jerking around regarding the Bush tax cuts, businesses CANNOT hire. Because when those cuts expire, companies will need the cash they are currently stashing to pay them This is not about democrats or republican philosophy....it's about where all of us (meaning myself, the wife and others I know) are....it is a little of both......us folks in the center
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
Bankruptcy doesn't mean the company would simply "disappear".
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
appletart2:
EADG:
I have to correct you on this point. Earnings are not the same thing as revenues. They are the same thing as net income. BP's earnings were not $240+ billion, they were $20.8 billion, if i'm reading the financial figures presented in oobu24's email correctly.
there going to file bankruptcy anyway..after they borrow 50 billion from a US bank..don't want to leave the country without a final... F%$# U.
Didn't know you are a BP insider....you don't know that as an "insider", that providing that type of information is illegal?? In any event, companies don't borrow that amount from just one bank as you indicate. That isn't how banking works.
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
beatlechick:
EADG:
I have to correct you on this point. Earnings are not the same thing as revenues. They are the same thing as net income. BP's earnings were not $240+ billion, they were $20.8 billion, if i'm reading the financial figures presented in oobu24's email correctly.
That appears to have been just one quarter.
Sorry, no.....those are annual (yearly) figures from oobu24. Glad to see EADG is on the case here.
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
Here is a review of the 4th quarter (ended December 2009) announced in February 2010: Integrated oil and natural gas BP (BP) Tuesday reported fourth-quarter earnings per share of $1.10, well below the Thomson/Reuters First Call consensus estimate of $1.51. The global energy giant also said it sees a "slow and gradual" recovery from the recession. For all of 2009, BP earned $4.47 per share, below the Thomson/Reuters First Call estimate of $4.73. By comparison, in last year's fourth quarter, BP earned 84 cents per share, and for all of 2008 it earned $8.17 per share. BP posted fourth-quarter revenue of $73.6 billion compared to the Thomson/Reuters First Cal estimate of $56.3 billion. Full-year 2009 revenue totaled $246.1 billion versus the consensus estimate of $234.6 billion. BP's shares sold off in early London trading Tuesday on the news, falling about 5%, or 28.40 pence, to 566.20 pence. See full article from DailyFinance: http://srph.it/98P4xJ btw there is difference between revenue (shown here) and net income (after taxes, expenses, interest on debt, etc). Usually people refer to what a company makes as net income (not shown here)
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
Andy, freedom of speech isn't yet enjoyed by the entire world. Did you happen to catch "60 minutes" last night?? Interesting piece about "the narrative". There was a cartoonist in Sweden (?) that was also threatened. People make threats in the heat of the moment. I do not think they should be jailed, though I do understand what you mean.
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RE: The ..2012.... Political thread
FWIW, I do think that independents, can recognize value without party attachment, or as you suggest left wing/right wing. We seem to be more in the middle. I am not suggesting that makes us "better", just different.