Paul McCartney, Elton John Set for Coronavirus Charity Special
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Bruce M. wrote:
oobu24 wrote:
Yankeefan2 wrote:
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With the possible exception of BJ, there has been nobody on this board who has been dying for McCartney to do more of his great songs live from his solo albums.
Before last weekend, the most critical thing I probably have said about his voice during concerts is that he really should not sing "Maybe I'm Amazed" anymore. I think quite a few people have agreed with me that he just can't handle that song very well anymore. I don't know what threads you are reading but most of them are 99.9% favorable to McCartney. Some of us are not fanboys/fangirls and will occasionally say something he did was not wonderful.
I've been in the more solo camp for years. Been there, done that years before you were a member here. I just got tired of saying the same thing over & over.
And mentioning not singing MIA is a perfect example of someone in his camp possibly reading this board & discussing the situation with Paul. Having someone tell him the truth is better than everyone walking around saying the emporor's clothes look fine.
Exactly. It is never kind or helpful to hide the truth from someone you care about. Thank you for saying this.
Totally agree with oobu and Bruce. Even though MIA is my favorite solo song by Paul, I was glad he finally dropped it (and The Long And Winding Road) from his setlist as he could just not do them justice at all. Let It Be and Hey Jude are still okay. (although I must admit I'm sick to death of hearing Hey Jude which when I heard it the first 100 times in 1968 I thought would never happen!)
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Paul didn't drop MIA from his setlist. He sang it in Moline last summer. And here's the problem. I agree, his voice during MIA is weak, but the reaction from the audience is simply amazing. While singing, he shows photos of him with his children in the early 70's. And photos of Linda. Is it heartbreaking? Of course. And again, the audience listens with such joy and the reaction after he finishes is loud. Very loud. It really is the emotional highlight of the show.
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wingsoverkc wrote:
Paul didn't drop MIA from his setlist. He sang it in Moline last summer. And here's the problem. I agree, his voice during MIA is weak, but the reaction from the audience is simply amazing. While singing, he shows photos of him with his children in the early 70's. And photos of Linda. Is it heartbreaking? Of course. And again, the audience listens with such joy and the reaction after he finishes is loud. Very loud. It really is the emotional highlight of the show.
He didn't sing it in Greenville, SC last May.
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Yea Nancy, he did. Check the YouTube version. As usual, the crowd went crazy.
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oobu24 wrote:
Yankeefan2 wrote:
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With the possible exception of BJ, there has been nobody on this board who has been dying for McCartney to do more of his great songs live from his solo albums.
Before last weekend, the most critical thing I probably have said about his voice during concerts is that he really should not sing "Maybe I'm Amazed" anymore. I think quite a few people have agreed with me that he just can't handle that song very well anymore. I don't know what threads you are reading but most of them are 99.9% favorable to McCartney. Some of us are not fanboys/fangirls and will occasionally say something he did was not wonderful.
I've been in the more solo camp for years. Been there, done that years before you were a member here. I just got tired of saying the same thing over & over.
And mentioning not singing MIA is a perfect example of someone in his camp possibly reading this board & discussing the situation with Paul. Having someone tell him the truth is better than everyone walking around saying the emporor's clothes look fine.
FYI - There was issue with my ID years ago and I had to get another one so my date of being a member is years before the one now. My old ID was Yankeefan7 and if my memory is correct I have been a member since 2006.
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Yankeefan2 wrote:
FYI - There was issue with my ID years ago and I had to get another one so my date of being a member is years before the one now. My old ID was Yankeefan7 and if my memory is correct I have been a member since 2006.
Good to know. I didn't mean anything derogatory by my original comment.
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wingsoverkc wrote:
Yea Nancy, he did. Check the YouTube version. As usual, the crowd went crazy.
I didn't remember him singing it. But, you're right, he did. (checked tour archives) Well, anyway, he needs to drop it.
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I do remember Paul singing MIA beautifully in 2002 and 2005. I kind of remember WIx's arm girations as Paul was hitting some of the high notes. And I loved the 2010 Concerts also in Philly (2 shows) because he had a bunch of new Wings (Venus & Mars/Rock Show, the blistering Letting Go, Ram on, 1985) and Beatlle songs (Two of Us, I've Just Seen a Face, I'm Looking Through You, Michelle etc.) that I hadn't heard live before and he was still singing top notch. I just don't remember how well he did on MIA but it was one of my favorite Paul shows because of all the songs I hadn't heard live before. It just seems that Paul's powerful voice went seriously down over the last 5-7 years from watching Youtube videos from these later shows.
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oobu24 wrote:
Yankeefan2 wrote:
FYI - There was issue with my ID years ago and I had to get another one so my date of being a member is years before the one now. My old ID was Yankeefan7 and if my memory is correct I have been a member since 2006.
Good to know. I didn't mean anything derogatory by my original comment.
Understood, just wanted to explain I have been around here a fairly long time also -lol
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B J Conlee wrote:
I do remember Paul singing MIA beautifully in 2002 and 2005. I kind of remember WIx's arm girations as Paul was hitting some of the high notes. And I loved the 2010 Concerts also in Philly (2 shows) because he had a bunch of new Wings (Venus & Mars/Rock Show, the blistering Letting Go, Ram on, 1985) and Beatlle songs (Two of Us, I've Just Seen a Face, I'm Looking Through You, Michelle etc.) that I hadn't heard live before and he was still singing top notch. I just don't remember how well he did on MIA but it was one of my favorite Paul shows because of all the songs I hadn't heard live before. It just seems that Paul's powerful voice went seriously down over the last 5-7 years from watching Youtube videos from these later shows.
The last time I saw McCartney live was in 2010 and he did MIA fairly well but you could tell it was starting to get harder. I understand it is his major hit and of course dedicated to Linda. That being said, why not re-arrange the song a bit to fit his vocal abilities now. He played re-arranged version of "Lady Madonna" last weekend so why not -lol.
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Bruce M. wrote:
Have to agree with the negative posts...Poor song choice and voice, I'll leave the arrangement for others to debate. I thought Mick sounded great and proper song choice. Elton was good. My surprise performance was Billy Joe Armstrong...I really liked it and I don't really listen to Green Day.
Paul tried to sing in a way that suited his vocal limitations (the other way to do it, of course, would be to surround himself with loud band and backing vocals, but that wasn't an option here). I do think it kind of worked, but it's also obvious that his voice is mostly shot. I find it oddly touching that some people on here insist he sounded fine, but ... no, he didn't. He's about to turn 78. It's okay to recognize he doesn't sound like a young man anymore.
Good points as usual Bruce. It's not just that he's almost 78, he has been touring incessantly since 2002. He's been doing 3 hour shows at almost all of them and singing hard songs like Maybe I'm Amazed, Let Me Roll It, Helter Skelter etc. Some people have mentioned Mick Jagger (almost his age) sounding much better but Mick hasn't toured nearly as much as Paul and when he has toured, he always has plenty of backup singers (I'm not talking about members of the Band but people who are strictly there to sing and support him. I'm not knocking Mick and maybe he's been smarter than Paul in protecting his voice. I give Paul all the credit in the world in that he has that blue collar mentality and has always given every show his all and for his fans but for a man his age, it will finally catch up to you.
This is why Yankeefan and I have repeatedly said that we wish Paul would stop these long tours, protect the limited voice he still has, and just concentrate on writing songs and maybe another album or two. How many of his contemporaries are still writing teriffic new and original songs like Paul. Not many in my opinion. That is still his strength even in his 70's so that is where my hope for Paul is. I keep on thinking about how good the bulk of songs on Egypt Station are and how good in general his "older voice" sounded. I just hope he slows down, enjoys traveling and works with Greg Kurstin again. Judging by the results of Egypt Station, Greg seems to have been a really good influence for Paul as his Producer so that is where I hope Paul concentrates after this Pandemic is over.
As you stated BJ, age and all that touring will catch up to you. Think of McCartney now like a great athelete who is obviously in decline and is ready to retire. There are days where they can rise to the occasion and do ok but it is rare. As a NY Yankee fan, it was painful watching Derek Jeter in his last year struggle and you were praying to God that the manager would bench him more often. McCartney is still excellent writing songs (I can't think of anybody is age doing this !!) and in the right studio setting can sound pretty good like in Egypt Station. Being alone with no backup support exposed his voice and it was not good. There is a news show I watch at night that had entertainment section and they mentioned this concert. They mocked the performances of Elton John, McCartney and Jennifer Lopez while praising the Stones. I am not saying the world will end because of this but just stating people did notice his voice and were not complimentary. Like you, I hope he can enjoy travel (when virus thing settles down), continue to write wonderful songs and maybe record another album. I also excited to see how he does writing a musical (It's A Wonderful Life") and hope it turns out well.
Not quite sure what was so praiseworthy about the stones . Charlie Watts "performance" I have to say was cringeworthy . Keith played about 3 chords during the entire appearance . Add the studio trickery - Paul could have done that . Also , in my opinion Mick Jagger isn't in the same league as Paul for singing - then or now ...
Plain and simple Jagger still sounded good, McCartney did not and they are close to the same age. The Stones also did not totally change the arrangement of their song. Yes, McCartney was a much more talented singer than Jagger but that is not the point now. Did you read the link "OOBU24" shared about Charlie Watts "drumming". Considering the circumstances, I think most people thought it was cool that he tried part of the performance in spirit. The Stones obviously made more of an effort to put on a more polished performance under the circumstance than McCartney.
Yes I did read it . I appreciated Paul's more honest performance . There will be people worldwide who think that Charlie's drums aside - this was fully live and all happening simultaneously . I think that's unfortunate . Give me the approach Paul took any day of the week .
The forensic examination of Paul's voice deterioration on this forum continues to astonish me . As I said , I've been hearing it for 30 years . I'm not getting what the fascination is with it . I can totally enjoy Paul's voice now . I couldn't care less thats it's roadworn and showing signs of its age . I don't believe it to be " shot " .
i appreciate that you thought Jagger / the stones sounded better . I just happen to disagree , and know many others that feel the same . Its remarkable that some of Paul's harshest critics post on this forum . I'd love to contribute to this forum more , but every time Paul does something , the same tired voice put downs emerge , and I feel the need to say I disagree . It's quite depressing really .
There are no harsh critics of Paul on this forum that I've seen. There are people who are honest about the greatly deteriorated state of his voice and those who pretend that it's not so. I'm with those who wish Paul would quit touring, save what's left of his voice -- which he can still put to good use under controlled studio conditions, as Egypt Station proves -- and give us a couple more great albums while he still can. Recognizing reality is not a "put down."
Everybody's "reality " is different . I recognise Paul's voice of 2020 is different from 1990 or 1980 or 1970 .
That's not the point . The point is , I still love to hear Paul sing right now . If you don't then there's nothing I can do about that . People should be allowed their own tastes and opinions . -
sarahlovesmacca wrote:
I said before the performance that I would enjoy seeing Paul no matter what he played, and I did. I was surprised by the song choice but I quite liked the arrangement (which he's done before, as others have mentioned already in this thread).
I expected the comments about his voice, as it's always an issue that is raised whenever he does anything these days. It's not something that has ever shocked or bothered me. He spent many years pushing his vocal cords to the limit and of course that was bound to take its toll eventually, not to mention his age. But I'm honestly okay with it. I think for the most part, he makes it work. On a side note, I can't count the number of times non-McCartney fans have asked me why I would bother going to see him with his voice the way it is etc. I just know it's a privilege to be in his presence and that he puts on an amazing show, so why wouldn't I?
Anyway, I'm so glad he's safe and well and it was lovely to see him, plus his speech about his mother was really touching.
Well said . Very much agree .
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Yankeefan2 wrote:
There are really no harsh critics of McCartney on this board. For every post that somebody like me says his voice is going downhill, there are 5 times as many posts saying how much I love his solo albums the last 40 years. In addition, I can't count the number of times I have said he is fantastic songwriter, incredible musician and had one of the best rock and roll voices ever. For example, I have said quite a few times that nobody does 50's rock as well as McCartney and his vocals on RDR were fantastic. I have also said he is the best rock act I have ever seen live and only Springsteen came close IMO. With the possible exception of BJ, there has been nobody on this board who has been dying for McCartney to do more of his great songs live from his solo albums. BTW - I would love somebody to show me a post where I said his voice sucked on any album. The fascination with his voice is that some people do not want to see McCartney finish his career sounding like a washed up Chuck Berry or Frank Sinatra which was sad. We want him to finish his career on a positive note and that is why some of us worry about his voice live.
Before last weekend, the most critical thing I probably have said about his voice during concerts is that he really should not sing "Maybe I'm Amazed" anymore. I think quite a few people have agreed with me that he just can't handle that song very well anymore. I don't know what threads you are reading but most of them are 99.9% favorable to McCartney. Some of us are not fanboys/fangirls and will occasionally say something he did was not wonderful.
Perception is an amazing thing . I'd say proclaiming " his voice is shot " is as critical as you can be of a singer . I saw him in Glasgow in December 2018 . In terms of vocal performance , the highs vastly outshone the lows . I've read two lovely posts on this thread . Every time Paul performs on something these days - I dread coming on here to read people talk negatively about his voice . I should probably just stop , because whilst I can recognise the passage of time , I fundamentally disagree . I can also accept it when people disagree with me , but as long as it's recognised as an opinion instead of " the gospel according to... "
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stuartshire wrote:
Yankeefan2 wrote:
There are really no harsh critics of McCartney on this board. For every post that somebody like me says his voice is going downhill, there are 5 times as many posts saying how much I love his solo albums the last 40 years. In addition, I can't count the number of times I have said he is fantastic songwriter, incredible musician and had one of the best rock and roll voices ever. For example, I have said quite a few times that nobody does 50's rock as well as McCartney and his vocals on RDR were fantastic. I have also said he is the best rock act I have ever seen live and only Springsteen came close IMO. With the possible exception of BJ, there has been nobody on this board who has been dying for McCartney to do more of his great songs live from his solo albums. BTW - I would love somebody to show me a post where I said his voice sucked on any album. The fascination with his voice is that some people do not want to see McCartney finish his career sounding like a washed up Chuck Berry or Frank Sinatra which was sad. We want him to finish his career on a positive note and that is why some of us worry about his voice live.
Before last weekend, the most critical thing I probably have said about his voice during concerts is that he really should not sing "Maybe I'm Amazed" anymore. I think quite a few people have agreed with me that he just can't handle that song very well anymore. I don't know what threads you are reading but most of them are 99.9% favorable to McCartney. Some of us are not fanboys/fangirls and will occasionally say something he did was not wonderful.
Perception is an amazing thing . I'd say proclaiming " his voice is shot " is as critical as you can be of a singer . I saw him in Glasgow in December 2018 . In terms of vocal performance , the highs vastly outshone the lows . I've read two lovely posts on this thread . Every time Paul performs on something these days - I dread coming on here to read people talk negatively about his voice . I should probably just stop , because whilst I can recognise the passage of time , I fundamentally disagree . I can also accept it when people disagree with me , but as long as it's recognised as an opinion instead of " the gospel according to... "
When you perform live and you are Paul McCartney people are going to notice your vocal performance. You disagree with me and some others on the current quality of his voice, that is fine. Believe me, I take no pleasure having to say IMO his vocal performance last weekend was poor. Just curious, should people only post positive things about McCartney but never mention something that may have not been so good? Put me in the camp with some others that I hope he stops touring and puts his energy in creating a new album.
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Does Paul sound the same as he did 30 years ago? Nope. Neither does Jagger. The difference is Mick sounds better now, than Paul does based on live shows. Pauls speaking voice is very croaky as well. It sounds very similar to roger Daltrey's voice prior to Roger having surgery on his vocal chords.
People say Mick relies heavy on backing singers, but Abe shadows Paul on almost every song, almost to the point where you hear more Abe than Paul. Watch Abe, and you'll see him do most of the heavy lifting. That doesn't happen with Mick in recent years, unless its a part of the song where the original recording had backing vocals. Mick pretty does all the lead vocals without the backing of his vocalist Bernard Fowler. Abe shadows Paul regardless.
As far as concerts/setlists. Paul should stick to a 2 hour show, ditch the soundcheck nonsense, and drink something onstage! Vocal exercises couldn't hurt either. Get rid of MIA and Helter Skelter which just shread his voice.
Also, not every song needs to be a tribute. Its really getting out of hand. MIA for Linda,Something for George,Love Me Do for G.Maritn, the Foxy Lady bit for Jimi, Here today for John etc. Not every song has to be some dramtatic moment to drive people to tears. Pick 25 songs and play them. Nothing more nothing less.
FYI here is the Stones new song. Over 2 mil views in one day. Not bad.
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It's days since I made my one post in this thread, a post I thought was calm and not blinkered BUT also kind and might make people think... but here we are, logged in for the first time since and surprise surprise the same people writing the same 2000 word essays on why Paul is crap as a singer etcetc. Give it a rest, you've said it ten times already does the thread really need an 11th. What's the buzz word at the moment - "be kind". How about it then. I f you don't like his voice fine, just don't go on and on and on and on repeating the same things over and over and over. Shouldn't there be more love in the world right now.. When he's not here anymore what will some of you have to moan about..
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Maccaroni1974 wrote:
Does Paul sound the same as he did 30 years ago? Nope. Neither does Jagger. The difference is Mick sounds better now, than Paul does based on live shows. Pauls speaking voice is very croaky as well. It sounds very similar to roger Daltrey's voice prior to Roger having surgery on his vocal chords.
People say Mick relies heavy on backing singers, but Abe shadows Paul on almost every song, almost to the point where you hear more Abe than Paul. Watch Abe, and you'll see him do most of the heavy lifting. That doesn't happen with Mick in recent years, unless its a part of the song where the original recording had backing vocals. Mick pretty does all the lead vocals without the backing of his vocalist Bernard Fowler. Abe shadows Paul regardless.
As far as concerts/setlists. Paul should stick to a 2 hour show, ditch the soundcheck nonsense, and drink something onstage! Vocal exercises couldn't hurt either. Get rid of MIA and Helter Skelter which just shread his voice.
Also, not every song needs to be a tribute. Its really getting out of hand. MIA for Linda,Something for George,Love Me Do for G.Maritn, the Foxy Lady bit for Jimi, Here today for John etc. Not every song has to be some dramtatic moment to drive people to tears. Pick 25 songs and play them. Nothing more nothing less.
FYI here is the Stones new song. Over 2 mil views in one day. Not bad.
Stones song is pretty good and about current situation in the world. I give McCartney credit for giving people their money's worth all these years with close to 3 hour shows. Unfortunately, this is not good for your voice if you tour as much as McCartney has done over the recent years. The soundchecks were all about the money, charging people big time dollars and you were not even that close to the stage. People who have gone to them seen to love it and don't mind paying lots of money for it, to each their own. That being said, there is no technical reason for a soundcheck to last around 1 hour every night. The water thing was just plain stupid that he did not do this for years, every vocal coach will tell you it is important.
In the never ending tributes, you forgot his wife Nancy gets one also with "My Valentine". I am surprised he has not done one for the children yet, just teasing everyone. Nobody expects McCartney to sound like he did many years ago. I think if he stays with the mid-tempo Beatle songs with Abe's backing he will sound fine. There are others like MIA that you notice how much his voice has aged. Like I said in another post, he will probably try to reschedule concerts postponed in 2020 to date in 2021.
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Eeee Cor Blimey wrote:
It's days since I made my one post in this thread, a post I thought was calm and not blinkered BUT also kind and might make people think... but here we are, logged in for the first time since and surprise surprise the same people writing the same 2000 word essays on why Paul is crap as a singer etcetc. Give it a rest, you've said it ten times already does the thread really need an 11th. What's the buzz word at the moment - "be kind". How about it then. I f you don't like his voice fine, just don't go on and on and on and on repeating the same things over and over and over. Shouldn't there be more love in the world right now.. When he's not here anymore what will some of you have to moan about..
First, if myself or anybody else wants to post 100 times about the same thing it is our choice. You don't like it, ignore the posts. Freedom of choice is a wonderful thing. I made one original post about his performance that night and then just responded to other posts. In other words, having an online discussion.Nobody said he was a crap singer. Several people said he did not have a good vocal performance last weekend.
I am sure you missed all the nice things I have said in this thread about McCartney like he is fantastic songwriter, great musician and the best act I have ever seen live. In addition, I mentioned how much I have loved his solo work over the years. I also said nobody does 50's rock covers better than McCartney and his vocals on RDR were great. Myself and BJ said his Super Bowl appearance was really good in 2005. Just tonight, I also mentioned how McCartney should be credited for giving people thier money's worth with 3 hour concerts. I will admit I said that sadly this affected his voice.
When McCartney is no longer with us, I will remember the times I saw him put on fantastic show (1976-2010). I will fondly remember seeing him on TV from Ed Sullivan show to now. I will remember his wonderful music because I have almost every album he has ever made in his career. I will regret him not doing more of his solo songs live because IMO the wonderful music he has created the last 40 years will not be acknowledged properly. Ok, I am done on this thread (lol).
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His name's Paul btw. Never understood why fans refer to him as "McCartney " repeatedly. always bugged me. Then again I'll get told that's your choice and if I don't like it I should ignore it. Ok then!
(Yes, if you want to say the same things 10000 times it's your right, I just felt in this thread everything seemed on loop, same same same thing, and a few saying otherwise got shot down with distain as being "wrong" rather than saying each to their own opinion. Hey I didn't think it was fantastic, but I stated reasons why that one performance may have been more rough than others - Linda's anniversary, sadness about family, etc, no one seemed to notice any reason other than "he's old his voice is shot". Constantly saying someone's performance was rubbish and voice now sounds terrible is the same to me as saying it was crap btw. And if I read Mick Jagger's name again I think I'll scream!! But too tired to argue! G'night!)
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Ps, look i m tired, grumpy, very depressed, fed up, stressed, so picking at things i would normally let go. I don't mean a big fight over it.