Wings 50th Anniversary
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Paul McCartney was put into the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame on his own and that included his work with Wings, no need to put Wings into the Hall Of Fame. Wings was not a super group, it was Paul McCartney and a couple of talented but not great musicians/singers. Are we really going to compare Wings to groups like The Who, Led Zepplin, and The Rolling Stones etc that had multiple great performers in their groups. Wings as a group had one great album (BOTR) and that album only was Paul, Linda and Denny and not entire band The rest of the albums were basically mediocre even if they sold well commmercially. I will give them credit that Wings was excellent live in 1976 but once again that was mostly due to Paul McCartney. I am glad Wings ended when they did, it was obvious Paul was no longer into being in a group and the last album showed it.
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Yankeefan2 wrote:
Paul McCartney was put into the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame on his own and that included his work with Wings, no need to put Wings into the Hall Of Fame. Wings was not a super group, it was Paul McCartney and a couple of talented but not great musicians/singers. Are we really going to compare Wings to groups like The Who, Led Zepplin, and The Rolling Stones etc that had multiple great performers in their groups. Wings as a group had one great album (BOTR) and that album only was Paul, Linda and Denny and not entire band The rest of the albums were basically mediocre even if they sold well commmercially. I will give them credit that Wings was excellent live in 1976 but once again that was mostly due to Paul McCartney. I am glad Wings ended when they did, it was obvious Paul was no longer into being in a group and the last album showed it.
Agree to disagree. Especially about Jimmy McCulloch and Laurence Juber being "talented, but not great." I've heard LJ play solo many many times since 2012 and he is the most fabulous guitarist I've ever seen! Here he is playing While My Guitar Gently Weeps:
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Nancy R wrote:
Yankeefan2 wrote:
Paul McCartney was put into the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame on his own and that included his work with Wings, no need to put Wings into the Hall Of Fame. Wings was not a super group, it was Paul McCartney and a couple of talented but not great musicians/singers. Are we really going to compare Wings to groups like The Who, Led Zepplin, and The Rolling Stones etc that had multiple great performers in their groups. Wings as a group had one great album (BOTR) and that album only was Paul, Linda and Denny and not entire band The rest of the albums were basically mediocre even if they sold well commmercially. I will give them credit that Wings was excellent live in 1976 but once again that was mostly due to Paul McCartney. I am glad Wings ended when they did, it was obvious Paul was no longer into being in a group and the last album showed it.
Agree to disagree. Especially about Jimmy McCulloch and Laurence Juber being "talented, but not great." I've heard LJ play solo many many times since 2012 and he is the most fabulous guitarist I've ever seen! Here he is playing While My Guitar Gently Weeps:
Yes, Laurence Juber is wonderful guitarist who played on one Wings album which most people think was not very good. Let's do a comparison. The Rolling Stones have Mick Jagger and Keith Richards. The Who have Roger Daltry and Pete Townsend. Led Zepplin had Robert Plant and Jimmy Page. Are you going to compare Laurence Juber and Jimmy McCullough to guys like Keith Richards, Pete Townsend and Jimmy Page? All three of those guys were ranked in the top 10 of all time great rock guitarists by Rolling Stone magazine. This is not a knock on Laurence Juber or Jimmy McCullough, it is just they IMO and others were not all time greats like the three guys I mentioned. I have been fortunate to see these three men live and also people like Clapton and Eddie Van Halen. Sorry the Wings gutiarists can't compare to them and I did see McCullough live in 1976. Like you said, I will agree to disagree.
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The thing about the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is that many groups get in only because one member is the "stand-out." Lots of examples: The Animals (Eric Burdon), CCR (John Fogerty), ELO (Jeff Lynne), Joan Jett & The Blackhearts, The Police (Sting), Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers, etc.
The main reason they probably haven't been nominated is because there were too many incarnations of Wings. They would have to induct every member and maybe they don't want to do that.
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Yankeefan2 wrote:
Nancy R wrote:
Yankeefan2 wrote:
Paul McCartney was put into the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame on his own and that included his work with Wings, no need to put Wings into the Hall Of Fame. Wings was not a super group, it was Paul McCartney and a couple of talented but not great musicians/singers. Are we really going to compare Wings to groups like The Who, Led Zepplin, and The Rolling Stones etc that had multiple great performers in their groups. Wings as a group had one great album (BOTR) and that album only was Paul, Linda and Denny and not entire band The rest of the albums were basically mediocre even if they sold well commmercially. I will give them credit that Wings was excellent live in 1976 but once again that was mostly due to Paul McCartney. I am glad Wings ended when they did, it was obvious Paul was no longer into being in a group and the last album showed it.
Agree to disagree. Especially about Jimmy McCulloch and Laurence Juber being "talented, but not great." I've heard LJ play solo many many times since 2012 and he is the most fabulous guitarist I've ever seen! Here he is playing While My Guitar Gently Weeps:
Yes, Laurence Juber is wonderful guitarist who played on one Wings album which most people think was not very good. Let's do a comparison. The Rolling Stones have Mick Jagger and Keith Richards. The Who have Roger Daltry and Pete Townsend. Led Zepplin had Robert Plant and Jimmy Page. Are you going to compare Laurence Juber and Jimmy McCullough to guys like Keith Richards, Pete Townsend and Jimmy Page? All three of those guys were ranked in the top 10 of all time great rock guitarists by Rolling Stone magazine. This is not a knock on Laurence Juber or Jimmy McCullough, it is just they IMO and others were not all time greats like the three guys I mentioned. I have been fortunate to see these three men live and also people like Clapton and Eddie Van Halen. Sorry the Wings gutiarists can't compare to them and I did see McCullough live in 1976. Like you said, I will agree to disagree.
Good topic Nancy and Yankeefan. To be honest and as much of a fan of Paul that I am, it's not that imortant to me if Wings gets in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. As you said, Yankeefan, Paul is already in the Hall as a Beatle and Solo Artist. I would much rather have Paul win an Album of the Year Grammy than Wings getting in the Hall. That's just me.
I do think that Wings are more deserving than a good number of artists already in the Hall. Granted Paul had the most to do with their success. But for close to 9-10 years they did have a lot of success which is a relative long time in the music business.
I do think that Venus and Mars was another very good album along with BOTR. I always thought that Red Rose Speedway could have given them a third good to great album. Circumstances out of their control kept them from having a 3rd very good album. The record company refused to approve the Double Red Rose Album they had planne which was a financial decision. The planned double album had much more variety in the tracks compared to the final album. And one of Paul's weaknesses is picking the right songs. The final album was too soft and it didn't help that Paul ended the album with the "soft" 11 minute ballad medley. Even if they stuck with the 1 album that EMI was demanding, how much better would Red Rose had been if they included songs like 1) The Mess 2) Best Friend 3) Live and Let Die (all very good rockers versus the Ending "Medley" track and the Loop (First Indian on the Moon) which was the next to last track. Even other songs that were on the original Double Album list like Country Dreamer, I Lie Around, Mama's Little Girl, NIght Out and Denny Laine's I Would Only Smile are far better songs than EMI chose and that Paul agreed.
Finally I always thought that Back to the Egg was a highly underrated album. Put those 4 albums plus all the singles, good deep cuts and B-Sides and you definitely have Hall of Fame material.
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Yankeefan, please don't get bent out of shape. I know it's a common mistake, but it's Jimmy McCulloch:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_McCulloch
and Henry McCullough:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_McCullough
(both fantastic Wings lead guitarists, imo)
P.S. Thanks for the support BJ!
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Nancy R wrote:
Yankeefan, please don't get bent out of shape. I know it's a common mistake, but it's Jimmy McCulloch:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_McCulloch
and Henry McCullough:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_McCullough
(both fantastic Wings lead guitarists, imo)
P.S. Thanks for the support BJ!
No problem Nancy. I know better and need to proof read my posts more carefully -lol
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"I do think that Wings are more deserving than a good number of artists already in the Hall. Granted Paul had the most to do with their success. But for close to 9-10 years they did have a lot of success which is a relative long time in the music business. "
BJ, whether we agree or not I believe Wings was looked at as Paul McCartney and his backup band. If Wings had another "star" close to the ability of Paul, they might have made it. The bands I mentioned in other posts had that additional star and the other guys in the band (exp. John Bonham, Keith Moon etc) were not too shabby either. Even "Bruce Springsteen And The E-Street Band" had another "star " named Clarence Clemons (The Big Man). If Wings ever did make it, that is fine with me but if they don't, I am ok with that also because Paul is in after The Beatles.
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Hey Yankeefan...as I said, It isn't as important to me if Wings gets into the Hall. If they did, I of course would be happy for Paul and Linda but it's not something I ever lose sleep over.
As far as the guitarists discussion Paul picked and used very good guitarists throughout his long Post Beatles' career. I always thought Henry McCullough, jimmy McCulloch, and Laurence Juber were terrific. I thuoght that Henry was very underated after listening to him in the 'live" shows in the early Wings lineup. Jimmy had his own very good style and Laurence was very good technically. That being said, Paul always had great guitarists in his Solo career as well. Robbie McIntosh was great in the Flowers in the Dirt and Off the Ground era and of course David Gilmour was fantistic with the Run Devil Run Band. And I think that Rusty Anderson and Brian Ray are great in his current Band.
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" That being said, Paul always had great guitarists in his Solo career as well. Robbie McIntosh was great in the Flowers in the Dirt and Off the Ground era and of course David Gilmour was fantistic with the Run Devil Run Band. "
I always thought it was a shame that McCartney did not do small venue tour with the RDR band which not only had David Gilmour on guitar but Ian Paice (Deep Purple) on drums. They could have done first set of the entire RDR album which was not that long and then had intermission. They come back for 2nd set with a few early Beatle classics and a couple of uptempo McCartney solo songs and it would have been quite the show IMO. This period was not that long after Linda's death so it is understandable he probably never thought of putting a small tour together.
As for his solo bands, Robbie was my favorite guitarist and Hamish was my favorite vocalist. Abe was my favorite drummer and close 2nd vocalist.
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Yankeefan2 wrote:
" That being said, Paul always had great guitarists in his Solo career as well. Robbie McIntosh was great in the Flowers in the Dirt and Off the Ground era and of course David Gilmour was fantistic with the Run Devil Run Band. "
I always thought it was a shame that McCartney did not do small venue tour with the RDR band which not only had David Gilmour on guitar but Ian Paice (Deep Purple) on drums. They could have done first set of the entire RDR album which was not that long and then had intermission. They come back for 2nd set with a few early Beatle classics and a couple of uptempo McCartney solo songs and it would have been quite the show IMO. This period was not that long after Linda's death so it is understandable he probably never thought of putting a small tour together.
As for his solo bands, Robbie was my favorite guitarist and Hamish was my favorite vocalist. Abe was my favorite drummer and close 2nd vocalist.
Yankeefan...you're so right. The RDR shows to promote the album were great. Unfortunately, that group was very short lived. Still can't believe how good Paul's vioce still souinded during that period.
Robbie was also a terrific guitarist and you're so right about Hamish Stuart being a great singer too. Looking on Youtube at the tour after the Off the Ground alubm was released, the "live" songs were very often a lot superior to their studio conterparts. Both Bands were highly underrated which is one reason I find that Paul's Post Beatles' Career is so interesting and varied.
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Nancy R wrote:
The thing about the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is that many groups get in only because one member is the "stand-out." Lots of examples: The Animals (Eric Burdon), CCR (John Fogerty), ELO (Jeff Lynne), Joan Jett & The Blackhearts, The Police (Sting), Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers, etc.
The main reason they probably haven't been nominated is because there were too many incarnations of Wings. They would have to induct every member and maybe they don't want to do that.
An excellent point. Cos I've always thought of Wings being basically Paul... with the "others"...but.. they were a 'band'.... even if I didn't always like Denny Laine... however, he was integral... and had some great input... some pretty good songs, and actually was integral to the band....the more I think about it, he contributed some really good songs... Linda, even if I don't quite acknowledge her skills... but, she was integral to the makeup of the band..... and taught herself how to play... live!....in fact, she was a big part of the band.... and, correct, the Police were basically Sting (although Andy Summers a great guitarist).... Tom Petty, also... I do agree... that WINGS were a big part of the 1970's and should be inducted!
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toris wrote:
Nancy R wrote:
The thing about the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is that many groups get in only because one member is the "stand-out." Lots of examples: The Animals (Eric Burdon), CCR (John Fogerty), ELO (Jeff Lynne), Joan Jett & The Blackhearts, The Police (Sting), Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers, etc.
The main reason they probably haven't been nominated is because there were too many incarnations of Wings. They would have to induct every member and maybe they don't want to do that.
An excellent point. Cos I've always thought of Wings being basically Paul... with the "others"...but.. they were a 'band'.... even if I didn't always like Denny Laine... however, he was integral... and had some great input... some pretty good songs, and actually was integral to the band....the more I think about it, he contributed some really good songs... Linda, even if I don't quite acknowledge her skills... but, she was integral to the makeup of the band..... and taught herself how to play... live!....in fact, she was a big part of the band.... and, correct, the Police were basically Sting (although Andy Summers a great guitarist).... Tom Petty, also... I do agree... that WINGS were a big part of the 1970's and should be inducted!
Plus Wings Over America is one of the greatest live albums that ever existed.... Paul found a way to find his wings through this band..... that's reason enough for me to elevate Wings to induction .
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Yankeefan2 wrote:
Paul McCartney was put into the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame on his own and that included his work with Wings, no need to put Wings into the Hall Of Fame. Wings was not a super group, it was Paul McCartney and a couple of talented but not great musicians/singers. Are we really going to compare Wings to groups like The Who, Led Zepplin, and The Rolling Stones etc that had multiple great performers in their groups. Wings as a group had one great album (BOTR) and that album only was Paul, Linda and Denny and not entire band The rest of the albums were basically mediocre even if they sold well commmercially. I will give them credit that Wings was excellent live in 1976 but once again that was mostly due to Paul McCartney. I am glad Wings ended when they did, it was obvious Paul was no longer into being in a group and the last album showed it.
Exactly. Wings may have even outsold the Eagles in the 70's, but in no way do they compare with the Eagles....a true supergroup... the group of the decade. No matter how we may want to look at it...or how the various interchangeable member of Wings want to look at it....Wings was Paul McCartney and some sidemen. To say that Wings could not have a reunion without Linda, and that to even try to, would be like the Beatles trying to have one without John Lennon is waaaaaay, well, lets just say, way out there and leave it at that. Paul's current sidemen are vastly superior to any he had with "Wings," but they remain just that....sidemen. He knows it. They know it. We all know it. Paul wouldnt dream of coming up with a band name.
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"and, correct, the Police were basically Sting (although Andy Summers a great guitarist).... "
FYI - Stewart Copeland was ranked 10th by Rolling Stone Magazine in a list of the 100th best drummers of all time so I guess The Police "sound" was not just about Sting.
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toris wrote:
toris wrote:
Nancy R wrote:
The thing about the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is that many groups get in only because one member is the "stand-out." Lots of examples: The Animals (Eric Burdon), CCR (John Fogerty), ELO (Jeff Lynne), Joan Jett & The Blackhearts, The Police (Sting), Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers, etc.
The main reason they probably haven't been nominated is because there were too many incarnations of Wings. They would have to induct every member and maybe they don't want to do that.
An excellent point. Cos I've always thought of Wings being basically Paul... with the "others"...but.. they were a 'band'.... even if I didn't always like Denny Laine... however, he was integral... and had some great input... some pretty good songs, and actually was integral to the band....the more I think about it, he contributed some really good songs... Linda, even if I don't quite acknowledge her skills... but, she was integral to the makeup of the band..... and taught herself how to play... live!....in fact, she was a big part of the band.... and, correct, the Police were basically Sting (although Andy Summers a great guitarist).... Tom Petty, also... I do agree... that WINGS were a big part of the 1970's and should be inducted!
Plus Wings Over America is one of the greatest live albums that ever existed.... Paul found a way to find his wings through this band..... that's reason enough for me to elevate Wings to induction .
Totally agree!
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Yankeefan2 wrote:
"and, correct, the Police were basically Sting (although Andy Summers a great guitarist).... "
FYI - Stewart Copeland was ranked 10th by Rolling Stone Magazine in a list of the 100th best drummers of all time so I guess The Police "sound" was not just about Sting.
I meant that the average person when asked about The Police could probably only name Sting. The same with the other groups I mentioned. Yet they were all still inducted.
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Nancy R wrote:
Yankeefan2 wrote:
"and, correct, the Police were basically Sting (although Andy Summers a great guitarist).... "
FYI - Stewart Copeland was ranked 10th by Rolling Stone Magazine in a list of the 100th best drummers of all time so I guess The Police "sound" was not just about Sting.
I meant that the average person when asked about The Police could probably only name Sting. The same with the other groups I mentioned. Yet they were all still inducted.
Gotcha.
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toris wrote:
Nancy R wrote:
The thing about the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is that many groups get in only because one member is the "stand-out." Lots of examples: The Animals (Eric Burdon), CCR (John Fogerty), ELO (Jeff Lynne), Joan Jett & The Blackhearts, The Police (Sting), Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers, etc.
The main reason they probably haven't been nominated is because there were too many incarnations of Wings. They would have to induct every member and maybe they don't want to do that.
An excellent point. Cos I've always thought of Wings being basically Paul... with the "others"...but.. they were a 'band'.... even if I didn't always like Denny Laine... however, he was integral... and had some great input... some pretty good songs, and actually was integral to the band....the more I think about it, he contributed some really good songs... Linda, even if I don't quite acknowledge her skills... but, she was integral to the makeup of the band..... and taught herself how to play... live!....in fact, she was a big part of the band.... and, correct, the Police were basically Sting (although Andy Summers a great guitarist).... Tom Petty, also... I do agree... that WINGS were a big part of the 1970's and should be inducted!
Isn’t the point that Paul apparently liked Denny Laine, regardless of whether you liked him? Apparently Linda liked him too. At any rate, he was in Paul’s band for 10 years, so there must have been something that Paul saw in him. I’m sure he must have worked with Linda and yes, it’s incredible how well Linda not only caught on and was an integral part of the band. I really hope Wings makes it into the RRHOF because they were the most favorite and memorable part of that era for me!
Go WINGS!!!
