The ..2012.... Political thread
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bill - i did not find you offensive at all - merely accurate. the interesting thing to me: if the united states is truly a nation of free expression, should obama not be invited to express himself? then, if the united states is truly a democracy, should not people just go vote for him or not? seems to me the discussion brings on much bigger issues than just obama... i'm surprised we in the u.s.a. are so shocked of an impending recession (and, as you mention, we drag the world along...) - with everyone's money going from their pockets into the 'global corporation' for 8 eight years, what is to be expected? the majority of us are growing financially poorer everyday as we pack the pockets of the 'haves.' on the surface we can say we are 'fighting terrorism' but what we are really doing is padding haliburton, the carlyle (spelling?) company, etc. today's headlines: exon makes giant profits...(because the price at the pump is crippling the consumer...they don't add that to the headline). in my opinion we can't get bush and cheney out of here fast enough. and, shame on them for what they are doing. i apologize for the rant. sometimes it just comes blowing out!!!
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Bill:
I'm sorry if the above post sounds kind of snippy. ops: It just gets tiresome being asked the same question every time. Think about it this way: If I say the phrase "The leader of the free world," who do you think of? If you answered, The president of the United States, then there's your answer. I live in the free world and I didn't vote for Bush. What's more, I didn't get to vote against him. Yet people keep talking about this person who I neither voted for or against as if he somehow runs my country too. How does that work? Then when I pass comment on it, people say, "You're Australian, what's it to you?" I'm not talking about you here Fan, but make your minds up people! You can't have it both ways. If this election were simply about what level the top income tax bracket kicks in at and whether there should be seatbelts on school buses, then you wouldn't hear much from me.
Bill, Benefit of the doubt taken. As I said before, I came to this thread simply to state my opinion and had not seen the other posts in which you were asked the same question about being from Australia and your interest in U.S. politics. We each know where the other is coming from. Take care.
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While I understand your points made about the flag.... it means too much to me - it is a symbol of the country and carries alot of meaning to me - What a sight to see the flag after the 911 attack - the flag being raised many times by the military - the respect for the foundation of this country. I take it as he giving the finger to the country (also can be symbolic). Perhaps he will cut out saluting, the bill of rights and the constitution while he is at it -- just words on paper -- a major reason I see him getting as far as he has is his ability to give a good speech and many (people that I know) would rather have him than Hilary any day. (I could not pull the voting lever for Hilary - but could for Obama if I had to). I will use this when weighing my decision on the others -- on a point system this is -1 for that. They all have plus and minus scores -- I don't have a leading candidate so far.
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The_Fool:
jaipur:
The issue of experience is a relevant one. I'm not convinced yet that he has developed enough cache within congress to actually get anything done even if he was elected.
Probably true -- that Country Club they have in Washington D.C. does seem to have its own set of rules and values -- The you scratch my back and possibly I will see that one day your back will be scratched -- of course he now has Kennedy and Kerry blocking for him -- so he should be able to get a few yards
It seems that is what he wants to change. Don't blame him at all. Although he has kennedy & kerry, it seems to me it takes more to rumble down there. That's the risk....can Obama pull it off. I liked what I saw in the debates last night from both candidates. It is also fascinating to see the foreign press all over it as well. The republicans are also fascinating to watch.
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Bill:
jaipur:
I wouldn't take the email going around about Obama at face value. btw, I should think that if Cheney had to switch to a koran to swear him in, you would've heard about that before now.
Did Cheney actually touch the Bible? I heard it burns him if he does.
I think he's still in that undisclosed bunker somewhere I' still find it interesting to read/hear comments about our elections from other countries. btw, last time I looked australia is not just a country but a continent...something the US can't attest to
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beawingsolo:
.... Perhaps he will cut out saluting, the bill of rights and the constitution while he is at it -- just words on paper --....
Who? Obama? Too late! Bush has already taken care of two out three of those.
jaipur:
btw, last time I looked australia is not just a country but a continent...something the US can't attest to
A trick of geography. We're also an island.
Fan Since 1964:
Bill, Benefit of the doubt taken. As I said before, I came to this thread simply to state my opinion and had not seen the other posts in which you were asked the same question about being from Australia and your interest in U.S. politics. We each know where the other is coming from. Take care.
You too mate! Apologies for the rant. I must admit, politics is my favourite sport.
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hop:
bill - i did not find you offensive at all - merely accurate. the interesting thing to me: if the united states is truly a nation of free expression, should obama not be invited to express himself? then, if the united states is truly a democracy, should not people just go vote for him or not? seems to me the discussion brings on much bigger issues than just obama... i'm surprised we in the u.s.a. are so shocked of an impending recession (and, as you mention, we drag the world along...) - with everyone's money going from their pockets into the 'global corporation' for 8 eight years, what is to be expected? the majority of us are growing financially poorer everyday as we pack the pockets of the 'haves.' on the surface we can say we are 'fighting terrorism' but what we are really doing is padding haliburton, the carlyle (spelling?) company, etc. today's headlines: exon makes giant profits...(because the price at the pump is crippling the consumer...they don't add that to the headline). in my opinion we can't get bush and cheney out of here fast enough. and, shame on them for what they are doing. i apologize for the rant. sometimes it just comes blowing out!!!
No need to apologize. In my opinion, more of us need to get up and start ranting. As a nation, we were a complacent bunch for many years, and now, since 9/11at least, we seem to be a depressed bunch. PTSD.
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The UK is having a mortage meltdown of their own. ExxonMobil made profits....businesses are supposed to do that. If you want to stick it to them, use a bicycle, get a hybrid Economies do go into recessions...they're supposed to. China's crapping in their drawers as their econony has been hot over the past years......they don't know what will happen when we stop buying Let's show them!
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Say Bill....any comments about your new pm? You didn't like the last one best I recall
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Haha! Well, I think Howard was secretly happy to have lost his seat. It saved him from having to either sit on the opposition backbench for three years or put his electorate through a by-election. Kevin is still in the honeymoon phase. Parliament hasn't sat yet. I have to say I like the man right now. It won't last - it never does. I think their first embarrassment is going to be the scheme to make internet service providers responsible for blocking objectionable content. It's just shifting the problem and it makes as much sense as making phone companies responsible for what people talk about on the phone. Aside from that, so far, so good. Give them time though. )
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I would hope that NOBODY is buying the email that says that Obama is a Muslim. Obama is NOT and NEVER WAS a Muslim. Obama has new ideas and can beat the Republicans. The Republicans want Hillary to run because they think they can beat her. I've heard Republicans say they don't know if they can beat Obama. I will be caucusing for Obama on Tuesday in my state. Saw Obama here on Wednesday and he has some excellent ideas. He also knows how to pack in a crowd and give an excellent speech. After the speech, he spoke in a much more relaxed manner to the precinct captains, of which I am one. He gave us some ideas and thanked us for all of our work. When I am not at work between now and Tuesday, I will be making phone calls to get my supporters to the caucus site on Tuesday. YES WE CAN!
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Bill:
Haha! Well, I think Howard was secretly happy to have lost his seat. It saved him from having to either sit on the opposition backbench for three years or put his electorate through a by-election. Kevin is still in the honeymoon phase. Parliament hasn't sat yet. I have to say I like the man right now. It won't last - it never does. I think their first embarrassment is going to be the scheme to make internet service providers responsible for blocking objectionable content. It's just shifting the problem and it makes as much sense as making phone companies responsible for what people talk about on the phone. Aside from that, so far, so good. Give them time though. )
They're supposed to sit mid february aren't they? I sometimes get to watch the UK parliament during the pm questions. And I must say a parliamentary democracy isn't for the faint of heart I heard something about an apology to the aborigines by the government? I was surprised by that as I had thought those issues were resolved some time ago. Apparently I was wrong. I do believe that's one of the reasons why our founders made the president not part of the legislative body. I like it like that. . Congress, whether you agree with them or not, wields the club. It's going to get hot on tuesday.....bring sunscreen
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RUDY GIULIANI dropped out!!!!! I haven't been keeping up on this stuff and am in total shock??? Why? He was the only one I thought 2 cents about. I am going to go cry about this. Now we have jerk Obama jerk Hillary jerk Romney and serveral others.......Damnation!!!
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letitbeamanda:
RUDY GIULIANI dropped out!!!!! I haven't been keeping up on this stuff and am in total shock??? Why? He was the only one I thought 2 cents about. I am going to go cry about this. Now we have jerk Obama jerk Hillary jerk Romney and serveral others.......Damnation!!!
That's how I feel during most elections! My sympathies--it's hard when the only choice for you is the lesser of two evils.
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Here's an interesting essay about Clinton and Obama from the International Leadership Forum: http://ilfpost.org/?p=254
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VOTE FOR ME....WEEEE WEEEE
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jaipur:
They're supposed to sit mid february aren't they? I sometimes get to watch the UK parliament during the pm questions. And I must say a parliamentary democracy isn't for the faint of heart I heard something about an apology to the aborigines by the government? I was surprised by that as I had thought those issues were resolved some time ago. Apparently I was wrong. I do believe that's one of the reasons why our founders made the president not part of the legislative body. I like it like that. . Congress, whether you agree with them or not, wields the club.
If they choose to. I'd love to play poker with Harry Reid. I could have the shittiest hand but it wouldn't matter, he would fold on every bluff. The apology has been a sticking point for over a decade. It's a little bit (and I stress, a little bit) analogous with states apologising for slavery. It's not as if anyone is saying that slavery wasn't a shameful thing, it's just that an official apology opens the doors for all kinds of compensation claims which should not be what reconciliation is about. Specifically, the apology would be for the policy in the mid 20th century of removing aboriginal children from their families and having them raised by white families. It has to be said that at the time, the intentions were mostly good, but one person's good intentions are another's cultural genocide. John Howard's position was always, "I'm sorry it happened but I'm not going to apologise for something I'm not responsible for." I see his point. As a white Australian, I'm not responsible for any aboriginal suffering and neither are any of my ancestors. I know that. But if saying I'm sorry will allow us to move on, then I'm sorry. The Rudd government made an official apology part of their platform and they're now taking submissions about how it will be worded. It will be interesting to see what happens next. I remember hearing Nelson Mandela speaking with reference to the subject many years ago and he said, "With apology must come forgiveness." That's just my take anyway. There are lots of opinions on the issue. Sorry for the tangent folks.
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letitbeamanda:
RUDY GIULIANI dropped out!!!!! I haven't been keeping up on this stuff and am in total shock??? Why? He was the only one I thought 2 cents about. I am going to go cry about this. Now we have jerk Obama jerk Hillary jerk Romney and serveral others.......Damnation!!!
Why? He hasn't won delegates to secure the nomination that's why. You probably won't have romney either at this stage. of course anything can happen between now and the conventions. Even ralphie boy is rearing his ugly head....again :
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Well take Romney out,,,,,,,I still have Obama and Hillary. That is worse than Romney. I am totally irritated.
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Thanks Bill. I agree with you about Reid. apparently the senate can't vote on the economic stimulus package until this week as he indicated he "needs" Clinton & Obama who are out on the stump. Gees.....the democrats don't have votes when they're holding the majority in the senate?