Was Paul REALLY the Walrus??
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Thanks brother! Great Abbey Road "zebra crossing" pic BTW! I went there back in '90 and it was interesting to hear that a lot of fans get their pic taken on the wrong one! There's an adjacent crossing they confuse the one on the album cover with. But you're on the right one!
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Yeah, I was terrified of doing just that! But there were enough tourists there doing the same thing so I felt safe enough that I had the right one. FYI - Ferris:
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I'm guessing I was there in July/August '90. There weren't any tourists other than me. Tons of Beatle graffiti on various Abbey Road signs which I took pics of. I remember the traffic being quite heavy (it was late afternoon and a gal I knew took me there before going to Heathrow to go back home) and it took a while before there were no cars and I could get my pic taken. The English gal who took my pic was a bit slow on the focus on my 35mm camera--way before the days of digital I like the way you took your pic though! My wife is English and I'll have to go back there next time we go back to visit her parents! Would love to go see Penny Lane too, but even my wife has never been to Liverpool and doesn't seem to have much of desire to go there...but I do
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OK, here is some more fodder for the conspiracy! Dug up this clip from Letterman interview in 2009, where "Paul" cites the first references to the "Paul is Dead" rumors on Abbey Road in 1969! The **real** Paul McCartney would surely know these rumors began some three years prior!
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I used to hear the last line on "Strawberry Fields" as "I'm very Bored". I was so disappointed to later find out that everyone was alive and well.
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Audley's Piano:
I used to hear the last line on "Strawberry Fields" as "I'm very Bored". I was so disappointed to later find out that everyone was alive and well.
HaHa! That's what I used to think John said when I was a kid of 12 (1967) Later, I thought "cranberry sauce?" What the hell does that mean?
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LiveForever:
OK, here is some more fodder for the conspiracy! Dug up this clip from Letterman interview in 2009, where "Paul" cites the first references to the "Paul is Dead" rumors on Abbey Road in 1969! The **real** Paul McCartney would surely know these rumors began some three years prior!
Not necessarily--most people in the U.S. weren't aware until 1969 when that DJ picked up on that college student's story/clues. So why would Paul (the real Paul) remember when it started? Paul has the worst memory!
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I thought PID started in 1969 with Russ Gibb's broadcast. after Abbey Road came out.
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Nancy R:
LiveForever:
OK, here is some more fodder for the conspiracy! Dug up this clip from Letterman interview in 2009, where "Paul" cites the first references to the "Paul is Dead" rumors on Abbey Road in 1969! The **real** Paul McCartney would surely know these rumors began some three years prior!
Not necessarily--most people in the U.S. weren't aware until 1969 when that DJ picked up on that college student's story/clues. So why would Paul (the real Paul) remember when it started? Paul has the worst memory!
Plus, Paul was having a drinking binge and a nervous breakdown in '69
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Erik in NJ:
Can't you clearly see John "taking the mickey out" (teasing) the cluesters by over dubbing "I buried Paul" over quotes from King Lear "oh, untimely death" in lyrics to "Strawberry Fields" (I had erroneously written "I Am the Walrus"...had Walrus on the mind due to prior post...oops ) or did he really say hey I'm gonna overdub the phrase "cranberry sauce" or "I'm very tall" here? Let's apply Occam's Razor shall we? Which do you think is more in the spirit of John's personality?? BTW, you can be darn sure if fans in the UK heard rumors about Paul being dead in '67 that Americans did too--it was before the internet but it sure wasn't the Dark Ages! Americans were in the fan club too!
The rumors didn't come out until '69. After Abbey Road was released. John randomly saying Cranberry Sauce is part of his personality. During Carnival of light, he yelled out all sorts of words like Barcelona. (yeah, that one got meaning). He used to count off saying Sugar Plum Fairy.
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Kathryn O:
The rumors didn't come out until '69. After Abbey Road was released. John randomly saying Cranberry Sauce is part of his personality. During Carnival of light, he yelled out all sorts of words like Barcelona. (yeah, that one got meaning). He used to count off saying Sugar Plum Fairy.
The rumors were prevalent enough in '67 that Freda Kelly addressed it in her fan club letter. If the Brits were talking about it you can be sure that some in the US were aware of it too. And if Freda was aware of it you can be sure the Beatles and the inner circle had gotten wind of the rumors too. John would have found this too fertile ground to not have some fun with add a bit of fuel to the fire. Bottom line is it was fun, whacky, "weird" (John always said he liked the MMT album the best it was so "weird") and it sold records. You know the story behind the highly cryptic lyrics to "I Am The Walrus" don't you? I will go back over the Freda Kelly video this weekend and get the particulars for this forum. Re "Cranberry sauce"--I have the hi-res files on that beautiful little green apple of the entire Beatles catalog--closest you can get to the master tapes! I'll listen to that one with headphones when I have a chance. We can speed it up too. When I've heard it sped up in the past to make it clearer it's fairly obvious that it's "I buried Paul."
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Erik in NJ:
Can't you clearly see John "taking the mickey out" (teasing) the cluesters by over dubbing "I buried Paul" over quotes from King Lear "oh, untimely death" in lyrics to "Strawberry Fields" (I had erroneously written "I Am the Walrus"...had Walrus on the mind due to prior post...oops ) or did he really say hey I'm gonna overdub the phrase "cranberry sauce" or "I'm very tall" here?
Just to let you know that as for the King Lear audio in "I am the walrus", the play was being broadcast live on BBC radio the night that they were recording Walrus, and it was literally them/George Martin twirling the knob on the radio and happening to pick up whichever lines were being said at teh time. It wasn't on purpose "oh untimely death". (They wanted speech, so picked the radio, and there it was)
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Kathryn O:
Erik in NJ:
Can't you clearly see John "taking the mickey out" (teasing) the cluesters by over dubbing "I buried Paul" over quotes from King Lear "oh, untimely death" in lyrics to "Strawberry Fields" (I had erroneously written "I Am the Walrus"...had Walrus on the mind due to prior post...oops ) or did he really say hey I'm gonna overdub the phrase "cranberry sauce" or "I'm very tall" here? Let's apply Occam's Razor shall we? Which do you think is more in the spirit of John's personality?? BTW, you can be darn sure if fans in the UK heard rumors about Paul being dead in '67 that Americans did too--it was before the internet but it sure wasn't the Dark Ages! Americans were in the fan club too!
The rumors didn't come out until '69. After Abbey Road was released. John randomly saying Cranberry Sauce is part of his personality. During Carnival of light, he yelled out all sorts of words like Barcelona. (yeah, that one got meaning). He used to count off saying Sugar Plum Fairy.
You are right KO, about when the rumors became known here (you & I were alive then and remember it quite well) And, yes, it was "cranberry sauce" even though I had originally heard "I'm very bored." Some vocalising by Lennon is faintly audible at the end of the song, picked up as leakage onto one of the drum microphones (close listening shows Lennon making other comments to Ringo). In the "Paul is Dead" hoax these were taken to be Lennon saying "I buried Paul."[45] In 1974, McCartney said, "That wasn't 'I buried Paul' at all?that was John saying 'cranberry sauce'. It was the end of Strawberry Fields. That's John's humour. John would say something totally out of sync, like cranberry sauce. If you don't realise that John's apt to say cranberry sauce when he feels like it, then you start to hear a funny little word there, and you think, 'Aha!'". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strawberry_Fields_Forever
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Nancy R:
Some vocalising by Lennon is faintly audible at the end of the song, picked up as leakage onto one of the drum microphones (close listening shows Lennon making other comments to Ringo). In the "Paul is Dead" hoax these were taken to be Lennon saying "I buried Paul."[45] In 1974, McCartney said, "That wasn't 'I buried Paul' at all?that was John saying 'cranberry sauce'. It was the end of Strawberry Fields. That's John's humour. John would say something totally out of sync, like cranberry sauce. If you don't realise that John's apt to say cranberry sauce when he feels like it, then you start to hear a funny little word there, and you think, 'Aha!'". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strawberry_Fields_Forever
Well you did say the other day that Wiki is notoriously wrong about things If Lennon was picked up by a drum mic then this song must have been a live take. I'll have to review the recording notes in Emerick's book. I have never heard another song (not counting Rev #9) where Lennon blurts out a seemingly random phrase like that. Any examples? The newly available hi-res files should give us the best chance of hearing what he said--I'm not a buyer of the "cranberry sauce" story even if Paul did say that back in '74. Re the King Lear as being totally spontaneous, again that's the story told, but who knows. What are the chances? Was the radio part on the beginning of "Wish You Were Here" just as random?
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Here's what Geoff Emerick says on p. 140-141 of his book: "Many of those subscribing to this ridiculous notion (the PID theory) even thought that John was somberly intoning the words "I buried Paul" at the very end of "Strawberry Fields Forever," during the so-called "freak-out" section. I'm sorry to disappoint anyone who ever bought into this rubbish, but Paul was, in fact, very much alive and well, and there was never any kind of plan to fool the public by scattering clues about his supposed demise. John was actually saying "cranberry sauce," not "I buried Paul." (he goes on to say that they had been talking about Americans & what they had for Thanksgiving dinner as it was recorded around that time of year.) ETA: Recorded on Nov. 24, 28, 29, 1966, as well as many other days. * I don't have Mark Lewisohn's book The Beatles Recording Sessions, but maybe someone who does can say what he says about the subject. Right before Blackbird on the White Album, John is heard mumbling a bit of nonsense and then says "Julian. " Play that backwards and it sounds like "Paul is dead. Miss him, miss him, miss him." * from the book "The 100 Best Beatle Songs" by Spignesi & Lewis.
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Interesting! Thx for the references...I'm surprised turkey, giblet gravy, and stuffing didn't make it in there I'm more interested than ever now to get to those hi-res files on that little green apple I have. Emerick could be right I guess--maybe he was talking about a meal on the tape. I still haven't seen any likely explanation for John writing the line "Here's another clue for you all..." in Glass Onion though. I know he said he wanted to say something nice about Paul for his diligent work, but calling someone a walrus (who came up with the animal costume idea and was there any original meaning attributed to them?) is hardly an overt compliment and there's still the enigma of the "clue." There must have been some meaning attributed to a "walrus" with Lennon later backtracking "I was the walrus, but now I'm John."
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Erik in NJ:
Nancy R:
Some vocalising by Lennon is faintly audible at the end of the song, picked up as leakage onto one of the drum microphones (close listening shows Lennon making other comments to Ringo). In the "Paul is Dead" hoax these were taken to be Lennon saying "I buried Paul."[45] In 1974, McCartney said, "That wasn't 'I buried Paul' at all?that was John saying 'cranberry sauce'. It was the end of Strawberry Fields. That's John's humour. John would say something totally out of sync, like cranberry sauce. If you don't realise that John's apt to say cranberry sauce when he feels like it, then you start to hear a funny little word there, and you think, 'Aha!'". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strawberry_Fields_Forever
Well you did say the other day that Wiki is notoriously wrong about things If Lennon was picked up by a drum mic then this song must have been a live take. I'll have to review the recording notes in Emerick's book. I have never heard another song (not counting Rev #9) where Lennon blurts out a seemingly random phrase like that. Any examples? The newly available hi-res files should give us the best chance of hearing what he said--I'm not a buyer of the "cranberry sauce" story even if Paul did say that back in '74. Re the King Lear as being totally spontaneous, again that's the story told, but who knows. What are the chances? Was the radio part on the beginning of "Wish You Were Here" just as random?
Oh, I don't think that was "a radio". That was like hearing a song from another room, as Syd was not on the radio at all by then. Syd was in another room. EDIT: Oh Christ. There is a radio.
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Erik in NJ:
Nancy R:
Some vocalising by Lennon is faintly audible at the end of the song, picked up as leakage onto one of the drum microphones (close listening shows Lennon making other comments to Ringo). In the "Paul is Dead" hoax these were taken to be Lennon saying "I buried Paul."[45] In 1974, McCartney said, "That wasn't 'I buried Paul' at all?that was John saying 'cranberry sauce'. It was the end of Strawberry Fields. That's John's humour. John would say something totally out of sync, like cranberry sauce. If you don't realise that John's apt to say cranberry sauce when he feels like it, then you start to hear a funny little word there, and you think, 'Aha!'". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strawberry_Fields_Forever
Well you did say the other day that Wiki is notoriously wrong about things If Lennon was picked up by a drum mic then this song must have been a live take. I'll have to review the recording notes in Emerick's book. I have never heard another song (not counting Rev #9) where Lennon blurts out a seemingly random phrase like that. Any examples? The newly available hi-res files should give us the best chance of hearing what he said--I'm not a buyer of the "cranberry sauce" story even if Paul did say that back in '74. Re the King Lear as being totally spontaneous, again that's the story told, but who knows. What are the chances? Was the radio part on the beginning of "Wish You Were Here" just as random?
There are quite a few examples of John blurting out random words and phrases on recordings throughout his life, from "I dig a Pygmy" to "eins zwei hickle fickle" to the outtakes from the "Think For Yourself" sessions ("all the walls of Rome couldn't stop me") to "Dig It" and so many others.
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Erik in NJ:
Interesting! Thx for the references...I'm surprised turkey, giblet gravy, and stuffing didn't make it in there I'm more interested than ever now to get to those hi-res files on that little green apple I have. Emerick could be right I guess--maybe he was talking about a meal on the tape. I still haven't seen any likely explanation for John writing the line "Here's another clue for you all..." in Glass Onion though. I know he said he wanted to say something nice about Paul for his diligent work, but calling someone a walrus (who came up with the animal costume idea and was there any original meaning attributed to them?) is hardly an overt compliment and there's still the enigma of the "clue." There must have been some meaning attributed to a "walrus" with Lennon later backtracking "I was the walrus, but now I'm John."
I just found out I do have Mark Lewisohn's book The Complete Beatles Recording Sessions! It was in a different room than most of my books. Page 90: "The trumpets and cellos were superimposed onto tracks three and four of the four-track tape so once again all four tracks were full and there was another reduction mix, take 25 becoming take 26. Onto this was added two separate recordings of John Lennon's lead vocal, tracks three and four. At the end of the second overdub John Lennon muttered the words "cranberry sauce" twice over....[Further deflating silly Beatles myths, John most certainly did not say "I buried Paul"!] Yeah, I never understood John's line "Here's another clue for you all...the walrus was Paul" either. What prior clues is he alluding to specifically? Besides, the person in the walrus outfit was clearly John as Paul (with his watch as per usual on his right wrist) is clearly the hippopotamus on the cover of MMT and in other photos of them in the animal get-up! Yeah, I was glad when John finally sang "I was the walrus, but now I'm John."
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favoritething:
There are quite a few examples of John blurting out random words and phrases on recordings throughout his life, from "I dig a Pygmy" to "eins zwei hickle fickle" to the outtakes from the "Think For Yourself" sessions ("all the walls of Rome couldn't stop me") to "Dig It" and so many others.
OK, name one on a released Beatles album (not an outtake) that was overdubbed within a song.